Fayetteville City Council Meeting June 11, 2012

>> WE'LL CALL THE JUNE 11th, 2012, FAYETTEVILLE CITY COUNCIL MEETING TO ORDER. WE THANK EVERYONE FOR BEING HERE TONIGHT ON THIS RAINY DAY, AND IF YOU WOULD STAND FOR INVOCATION LED BY AN ASSOCIATE MINISTER OF THE CHAPEL. IF YOU WOULD REMAIN STANDING FOR OUR PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE. >> LET US PRAY. DEAR GOD OUR HEAVENLY FATHER, WE THANK YOU. WE THANK YOU FOR ALLOWING US TO COME TOGETHER ONE MORE TIME TO DISCUSS BUSINESS ABOUT OUR CITY OF FAYETTEVILLE AND OUR COUNTY OF CUMBERLAND. FATHER GOD, WE KNOW THAT YOU'RE ABLE TO DO ALL THINGS, AND GOD, WE THANK YOU BECAUSE YOU HAVE ALL OF US IN THE PALM OF YOUR HAND. FATHER GOD, WE ARE SO PROUD THAT YOU DON'T GO FOR RED, WHITE, YELLOW, GREEN, OR BLUE BUT YOU ARE FOR ALL OF US, O, GOD, WE ALL ARE PRECIOUS IN YOUR SIGHT. SO WE WANT TO THANK YOU, O, GOD ON AND BEHALF OF EVERYONE ASSEMBLED HERE TODAY FOR WHATEVER REASON, WHATEVER DESIRE THEY HAVE THAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO DISCUSS, FATHER, I PRAY THAT THE COMMITTEE WILL SEE THEM AS AN INDIVIDUAL, WILL TAKE HEED TO WHAT THEY HAVE TO SAY, O, GOD WE JUST THANK YOU FOR EVERYTHING THAT YOU HAVE DONE FOR US ALL DAY LONG. HOW YOU HAVE BLESSED US. HAVE YOU HAVE KEPT US, AND HOW YOU HAVE STOOD BY US. HOW YOU HAVE WATCHED OVER US, AND HOW YOU HAVE BROUGHT US SAFELY HERE, O, GOD, WITHOUT ANY HURRIED HARM OR DANGER AND WE JUST WANT TO SAY THANK YOU. WE WANT TO SAY THANK YOU, O, GOD, BECAUSE WE KNOW YOU ARE ABLE TO DO ALL THINGS, EVERYTHING BUT FAIL AND WE JUST COUNT IT A BLESSING TO KNOW THAT EVERYONE HERE IS ON ONE ACCORD, THAT WE WANT WHAT'S BEST FOR THIS CITY, THIS CITY OF FAYETTEVILLE. FATHER, WE ALL GIVE YOU THE GLORY. WE ALWAYS GIVE YOU THE POWER. WE GIVE YOU EVERYTHING, O, GOD, BECAUSE WE KNOW THAT YOU GAVE IT TO US AND WE JUST WANT TO GIVE IT BACK. FATHER GOD WE ASK YOU TO BLESS US AND HELP US AND KEEP US, AND LET US BE MINDFUL OF ALL THE THINGS THAT WE ASK FOR IN JESUS' NAME. AND FATHER GOD, WE ASK YOU AT THE END OF THIS SESSION TO DISMISS US FROM THIS PLACE BUT NEVER FROM YOUR PRESENCE. AND GIVE US TRAVELING MERCY BACK TO OUR DESTINATION SAFELY. IN JESUS' NAME, WE PRAY. AMEN. [FLAG SALUTE] >> THERE ARE SEVERAL BITS OF INFORMATION TO SHARE WITH YOU, BEGINNING WITH MR. HURST. >> THANK YOU, MR. MAYOR. I JUST WANT TO NOTIFY THE CITY OF FAYETTEVILLE, THAT WE ARE SEEKING APPLICANTS FOR SEVERAL BOARDS AND COMMISSIONS AND THAT DOES INCLUDE THE NEWLY ADDED RESIDENTIAL REVIEW PROPERTY BOARD WHICH WE ARE SEEKING SEVEN VOLUNTEERS TO SERVE. SO PLEASE GO ONLINE TO THE WEB SITE AND UNDER THE TOPIC BOARDS AND COMMISSIONS OR CALL OUR CITY CLERK MS. PAMELA McGILL, AND SHE WILL SEND YOU THE APPLICATION. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU, SIR. MS. DAVY. >> GOOD EVENING, EVERYONE. I WANTED TO ANNOUNCE TO THE PUBLIC THAT WE HAVE OUR ALL AMERICA CITY FINALE AS WE WRAP UP A WONDERFUL YEAR OF ALL AMERICAN CITY. THERE WILL BE A SWAMP DOG FINALE FOR THE ALL-AMERICAN CITY THIS. IT'S COMING UP THIS SATURDAY. JUNE 16th AT 7:00 P.M. SO YOU ARE ALL WELCOME TO COME OUT TO THE SWAM DOGS FAYETTEVILLE GAME AS WE CELEBRATE THE ALL-AMERICAN CITY FINALE THIS SATURDAY AT 7:00 P.M. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU. MR. HAIRE? >> THERE IS GOING TO BE A -- WE ARE HAVING A BRAGG BOULEVARD CORRIDOR MEETING SERIES THAT'S GOING ON ALL WEEK. IT STARTED TODAY, AND IT'S GOING TO GO FROM JUNE 11th TO JUNE THE 13th, 2012. ALL OF THOSE MEETINGS WILL BE HELD IN THE AIT SPECIAL HALL AT 421 MAIDEN LANE. NOW ONE OF THE BIG ONES -- THE MAIN PRESENTATION WE ARE ASKING THE PUBLIC TO COME OUT TO, MAYOR AND COUNCIL, WOULD BE JUNE THE 13th. THAT'S GOING TO BE FROM 6:00 TO 8:00, SO IF YOU WANT TO GIVE YOUR PUBLIC PERSPECTIVE, PLEASE COME OUT TO THE BRAGG BOULEVARD MEETING SERIES. THE PUBLIC MEETING FOR THE CITY IS GOING TO BE ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE THE 13th, FROM 6:00 TO 8:00 AT THE AIT FESTIVAL HALL, AND THAT IS AT 421 MAIDEN LANE. THAT'S DOWNTOWN FAYETTEVILLE. THANK YOU, MAYOR. >> THANK YOU, SIR. ANY OTHERS, COUNCIL? OKAY, WE'LL MOVE NOW TO ITEM 4, WHICH IS APPROVAL OF TONIGHT'S AGENDA. MIGHTY QUIET. MR. BATES? THANK YOU, MR. BATES. ALWAYS COUNT ON YOU, SIR. THANK YOU, MR. CRISP. ANY DISCUSSION ON APPROVAL OF THE AGENDA? LET ME ASK FOR YOUR VOTE, PLEASE. THAT IS UNANIMOUS, AND WE'LL NOW MOVE TO TONIGHT'S PUBLIC FORUM. GIVE THE GUIDELINES FOR THAT. AS YOU KNOW, THE PUBLIC FORUM IS DESIGNED TO INVITE CITIZEN INPUT AND DISCUSSION. THE PUBLIC FORUM SHALL LAST NO LONGER THAN 15 MINUTES AND EACH SPEAKER WILL HAVE TWO MINUTES TO DISCUSS ISSUES RELATED TO THE CITY OF FAYETTEVILLE. IF YOU ARE INTERESTED ON SPEAKING ON ANY OF THE ITEMS INCLUDED IN TONIGHT'S LUBLIC HEARING, WE ASK YOU RESERVE YOUR COMMENTS UNTIL THAT PUBLIC HEARING. WHEN YOU SEE THE LIGHT LOCATED ON THE PODIUM CHANGE FROM GREEN TO YELLOW, THAT MEANS THERE ARE APPROXIMATELY 30 SECONDS LEFT OF YOUR 2POINTS, AND WHEN YOU SEE THE TIMER LOCATED ON THE PODIUM BLINK AND CHANGE FROM YELLOW TO RED, THAT MEANS THE FULL TWO MINUTES HAVE EXPIRED. WHEN YOUR NAME IS CALLED KEY ASK YOU COME TO THE PODIUM AND STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD. WE SEE WE HAVE A SIZABLE NUMBER OF PEOPLE HERE TONIGHT SO WE ASK THAT YOU HELP BE RESPECTFUL OF EVERYONE'S TIME. MA'AM, WE WILL OPEN THE PUBLIC FORUM. >> Translator: YES, >> YES, SIR. OUR FIRST SPEAKER IS MR. CHRISTOPHER TOBER. >> MY NAME IS CHRISTOPHER TOBER, AND I WAS BORN AND RAISED HERE IN FAYETTEVILLE. AND I'M HERE TO SPEAK ABOUT THE WAY ME AND MY MOM WERE TREATED IN THE CITY OF FAYETTEVILLE. WE WENT TO PROJECT OPERATION -- ON APRIL 20th. WE CAME TO SEE ABOUT -- THE SHOWER TO SEE A LAWYER, AND WE HAD 13 DOGS IN OUR CAR AT THE TIME, AND WE WERE TRYING TO GET A SHOWER, AND AS SUE ANNE BURG TOLD US IT WAS HOT IN THE MORNING. SHE SAW THE DOGS PANTING AND SHE TOLD US TO LET OUR DOGS OUT AND THEN SHE CALLED THE POUND WHILE WE THEY WERE RUNNING AROUND AND WHILE THE GATE WAS LOCKED. AND SHE CALLED THE POUND AND SAID THEY HAD NO LEASHES ON THE -- BECAUSE I KNOW FAYETTEVILLE HAS A LEASH, CUMBERLAND COUNTY DOES AND SHE TOLD US TO LET THE DOGS OUT AND THEN SHE CALLED THE POUND AND SAID THEY DIDN'T HAVE LEASHES ON ALL 13 DOGS. SHE IS THE ONE WHO TOLD US TO LET THEM OUT. AND SHE SAID WE WERE STARVING THE DOGS, WHICH WAS UNTRUE. WE HAD DOG FOOD IN THE CAR. AND WE WERE KICKED OUT OF OUR HOUSE BECAUSE THE DOGS IN -- BUT WE DINTD -- DIDN'T LIVE IN FAYETTEVILLE. WE WERE TRYING TO GET A HOUSE IN HUNTING COUNTY, THERE IS NO LAW HOW MANY DOGS YOU CAN HAVE IN THAT COUNTY, AND NOWHERE IN OUR LEASE SAID HOW MANY DOGS WE CAN HAVE BECAUSE UNDER OUR OLD PROPERTY MANAGER WE HAD, IT DIDN'T SAY HOW MANY DOGS WE COULD HAVE. AND WE -- THEY ALSO SAID OUR DOGS HAVE MANGE. THEY HAVE DERMATITIS THEY ARE EATING THE HAIR OFF THE SKIN OF EACH OTHER. AND IT WAS A CITY COP -- THE CITY POLICEMAN CAME TO THE POUND, AND HE WON'T LET US LEAVE. WE HAD AN POINT TO -- AN APPOINTMENT TO SEE A LAWYER. >> WE APPRECIATE YOU COMING, SIR. THANK YOU VERY MUMP. -- MUCH. >> OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS SHARMAIN TOBER. >> GOOD EVENING. I'M HIS MOTHER. >> GOOD EVENING. >> CHRISTOPHER'S TOBER, AND I JUST WANT TO REFIRM WHAT HE SAID. LIKE HE SAID, WE CAME HERE, AND WE THOUGHT WE WOULD BE WELCOMED. WE WERE HAVING A SITUATION WE WERE DEALING WITH, IN RETURN I WAS TRYING TO GET -- YOU KNOW, CUMBERLAND IS SUPPOSED TO BE ALL -- FAYETTEVILLE IS SUPPOSED TO BE ALL-AMERICAN CITY AND I EXPECTED TO BE TREATED. MY FATHER SPENT 33 YEARS IN THE AIR FORCE. MY EX-HUSBAND SPENT EIGHT. AND MY SON'S BEEN IN ALMOST 20 YEARS IN THE AIR FORCE. WE ARE TRULY A MILITARY FAMILY. AND LIKE I SAID, AND I HAVE NEVER BEEN TREATED SO BAD IN ALL MY LIFE AS I WAS OUT THERE. I WAS LIED TO. I WAS DECEIVED. AND THEN THEY CAME AND TOOK MY DOGS, AND NOW THEY WON'T TELL ME WHERE THEY ARE. I DON'T APPRECIATE THAT. AND LIKE I SAID, I HAVE BEEN INVESTIGATING WHAT'S GOING ON OUT THERE, AND I'M NOT HAPPY. NOT ONE BIT WITH CUMBERLAND COUNTY. I MEAN, FAYETTEVILLE CITY OR CUMBERLAND COUNTY. YOU TWO ARE SEPARATE BUT YET YOU ARE IN EACH OTHER AND IT'S CONFUSING BUT LIKE I SAID I AM WORKING ON THE DIFFERENCES. BUT LIKE I SAID, WE ARE, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO BE ALL-AMERICAN CITY, AND ACCORDING TO THE THING YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO WELCOME EVERYBODY, ALL CULTURES, ALL RACES, YOU KNOW, EVERYBODY, AND I DON'T FEEL LIKE WE WERE TREATED THAT WAY AT ALL. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU, MA'AM. THANK YOU FOR COMING, MA'AM. >> OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS MS. JOYCE MALONE. >> GOOD EVENING, MR. MAYOR AND THE CITY COUNCIL. I AM JOYCE MALONE, AND I LIVE AT 516 SPALDING STREET, BROADDALE AREA HERE IN FAYETTEVILLE, NOIRL. I WOULD -- NORTH CAROLINA. I WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK TO YOU ON THE BOARD REFERENDUM OF PARKS AND RECREATION. I HAVE BEEN A CITIZEN OF FAYETTEVILLE FOR 50-PLUS YEARS, AND I SPOKE WITH NEIGHBORS AND ALSO MEMBERS ABOUT THIS ISSUE. IF WE ARE TO BE THE ALL-AMERICAN CITY WE CLAIM TO BE, THEN THE PUBLIC SHOULD HAVE THE RIGHT TO VOTE. GIVE THE CITIZENS OF FAYETTEVILLE AN OPPORTUNITY TO VOTE ON THIS ISSUE. NOT JUST YOU, THE CITY COUNCIL, ALONE. AND PLEASE DO NOT REMOVE THE ITEM, PARKS AND RECREATION, FROM THE AGENDA TONIGHT BECAUSE SOME COUNCILMEMBERS ARE NOT INTERESTED IN HOW THE PUBLIC FEEL ABOUT HAVING A PUBLIC FACILITY UPGRADED OR NEW AT THIS TIME. I WILL SAY AGAIN DO THE RIGHT THING AND GET THE PUBLIC INVOLVED. GIVE THEM THE RIGHT TO VOTE. PUT THIS ITEM ON THE BALLOT. DON'T STALL AND PUT IT ASIDE FOR ANOTHER 90, A YEAR -- 90 DAY SAID -- DAYS OR A YEAR. THINGS CAN BE ACCOMPLISHED. LET'S DO IT. REMEMBER, THIS IS GOOD FOR THE WHOLE CITY. FOR THOSE COUNCILMEMBERS WHO HAVE NOT VISITED OR EVEN SPOKE RECENTLY WITH THE RECREATION CENTER DIRECTORS, I ADVISE YOU TO DO SO. ALL OF YOU KNOW FAYETTEVILLE NEEDS TO MOVE UP A NOTCH WITH THEIR FACILITIES. JUST ASK THE CITIZENS. I SAY AGAIN, DO THE RIGHT THING AND LET THE CITIZENS DECIDE. BECAUSE IT'S THE CITIZENS WHO WILL BE USING THE PARKS AND THE RECREATION CENTERS, AND ABOUT THE THIS ITEM ON THE BALLOT FOR THEM TO VOICE THEIR OPINIONS. THANK YOU, MR. MAYOR, AND COUNCIL. >> THANK YOU, MA'AM. THANK YOU FOR COMING. >> OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS MR. GREG WEST. >> GOOD EVENING, MAYOR AND COUNCIL. I'M GREG WEST LIVE AT 506 CHARLESTON PLACE. FIRST OF ALL, I WANT TO THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE. BUT I'M HERE AS A NATIVE OF FAYETTEVILLE, A CITY I LOVE, AND I'M A PARENT, PROUD PARENT OF THREE YOUNG CHILDREN. I'M ALSO A THREE-TERM MEMBER FOR CUMBERLAND COUNTY BOARD OF EDUCATION, AND WHILE I AM NOT HERE IN THAT CAPACITY, THOSE TEN YEARS OF SERVICE HAVE GIVEN ME A UNIQUE PERSPECTIVE INTO THE HEALTH, RECREATIONAL, AND EMOTIONAL DEVELOPMENT OF OUR CHILDREN AND WHAT PHYSICAL ACTIVITY AND TEAM SPORTS CAN DO FOR OUR YOUTH. OUR YOUTH NEED MORE AND BETTER, SAFE PLACES TO DEVELOP INTO THE WELL-ROUNDED, HEALTHY, YOUNG ADULTS WE DESIRE THEM TO BE. HERE'S A FEW THOUGHTS. ADDITIONAL THOUGHTS. THIS PAST SATURDAY, 54,000 KIDS HAVE GOTTEN OUT OF SCHOOL ON FRIDAY, AND IT WAS GREAT WEATHER. THIS ALL-AMERICAN CITY WITH OVER 200,000 RESIDENTS IN A COUNTY OF OVER 300,000 RESIDENTS DIDN'T HAVE A POOL OPEN FOR OUR CHILDREN. OUR ONLY POOL WAS CLOSED FOR REPAIRS AND LEARNING TO SWIM IS A MATTER OF LIFE AND DEATH FOR OUR CHILDREN. SWIMMING 124 IS THE FASTEST GROWING SPORT. THEY HAVE TO TRAVEL ACROSS THE COUNTY TO PRACTICE. WE NEED TO HOST REGIONAL EVENTS HERE INSTEAD OF HAVING TO TRAVEL TO BIGGER CITIES, AND THAT'S TRUE WITH BASEBALL OR TENNIS TOURNAMENTS AS WELL. THE PLAN IS SOMETHING FOR EVERYONE. IT'S A GOOD PROPOSAL. IT HAS BROAD COMMUNITY INPUT IT HAS BEEN THOUGHT ABOUT BY EXPERTS IN YOUR FIELD AND STATE AND NATIONAL STANDARDS. ANY DELAY IN CONSTRUCTION WILL BE A DELAY FOR YEARS TO COME. IT'S GOING TO TAKE YEARS TO BUILD OUT ANYWAY. THINK BACK TO THE CROWN COLISEUM. IT WAS CONTROVERSIAL AND SOME STILL LIKE TO MAKE A LOT OF FUN OF IT BUT LOOK WHERE WE WOULD BE WITHOUT IT. WE JUST SPENT 300 DAYS GRADUATING ADULTS IN DIGNIFIED, RESPECTFUL AIR CONDITIONED CEREMONIES BROADCAST TO SOL JORS OVER -- SOLDIERS OVER THE INTERNET. AFTER 20 YEARS IN MUCH SMALLER GREENVILLE, NORTH CAROLINA, THE NORTH CAROLINA BASKETBALL CHAMPIONSSHIPS HAVE COME BACK HERE. MY POINT IS YOU CAN'T IMAGINE ALL THE EVENTS THAT WOULD TAKE PLACE IF THE NEW PARKS FACILITIES -- IN THE NEW PARKS FACILITIES. IT'S JUST A CITY WE WANT TO BE HAS FACILITIES LIKE THAT. IT'S EXPECTED AND DESERVED. THE PARKS BOND IS NO DIFFERENT. THE RESIDENTS OF FAYETTEVILLE DESERVE THE RIGHT TO VOTE ON IT. PLEASE THINK BIG AND THINK BOLD. AND ON BEHALF OF THE CHILDREN, THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU, SIR. >> ORY, OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS MR. MIKE. >> HOW YOU DOING. MY NAME IS MIKE. 700. I'M A TO THEUE ARTIST HERE IN FAYETTEVILLE ALONG WITH MY FIANCE WE OWN A TATTOO STUDIO A MEMBER OF THE CHAMBER OF COMMERCE. I WANT TO ADDRESS YOU TODAY CONCERNING THE TATTOO LAWS IN NORTH CAROLINA. CURRENTLY, THERE ARE NO TRAINING REQUIREMENTS FOR A PERSON TO PERFORM TATTOOING. THESE LAWS WERE ADOPTED BACK IN 1995, AMENDED IN 2002, AND ARE SERIOUSLY OUTDATED. THE CURRENT LAWS EVEN ALLOW THE DISPOSAL OF CONTAMINATED TATTOO NEEDLES BY ORDINARY TRASH COLLECTION SERVICES. USED TATTOO NEEDLES ARE BIOHAZARDOUS WASTE AND SHOULD BE TREATED AS SUCH INCLUDING DISPOSAL OF. TELEVISION AND MEDIA HAVE EXPLOITED THIS ONE SACRED ART FORM AND WITH IT CREATED THE IDEA THAT ANYBODY CAN DO TATTOOS. MONEY IS THE ONLY ISSUE NEEDED TO BE ABLE TO ISSUE A TATTOO PERMIT. EACH CITY AND COUNTY IS DIFFERENT. THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO TRAINING REQUIREMENT FOR SOMEONE TO PERMANENTLY ALTER ANOTHER PERSON'S BODY. IN COMPARISON WITH NEARLY EVERY OCCUPATION THAT EXISTS, SOME FORM OF TRAINING IS REQUIRED, AND TATTOOING SHOULD NOT BE EXCLUDED. OTIA DPEETION -- OSHA MANDATES REGARDLESS WHAT THE NORTH CAROLINA LAWS STATES. I DON'T FIND A REASON WHY CUMBERLAND COUNTY CAN'T ADD TO THE FEE OSHA TRAINING AND SPECIFIC TRAINING TO TATTOOING. I PROPOSE MY ELECTED OFFICIALS GIVE THIS MATTER SERIOUS ATTENTION. ALTHOUGH THERE ARE RISKS WHEN IT COMES TO TATTOOING, TATTOOS AND TATTOOING ARE SAFE IF PROPERLY EXECUTED BY TRAINED INDIVIDUALS. BUT BECAUSE OF THE LAWS THERE ARE UNTRAINED TATTOO ARTISTS IN THIS CITY EXPOSING THE COMMUNITY. REGARDLESS OF YOUR PERSONAL OPINION OF TATTOOS OR PEOPLE WHO HAVE TATTOOED, I EMPLOYER YOU TO FOCUS ON THE SAFETY OF THIS AWARD-WINNING CITY AND NOT JUST THE REVENUE THAT TATTOOING BRINGS TO THE TABLE. >> THANK YOU, SIR. THANK YOU FOR COMING. >> OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS MR. MUHAMMAD SMITH. >> I DON'T THINK MR. SMITH IS HERE, MA'AM. >> MR. J.D. POUND. >> GOOD EVENING, MAYORS, MEMBERS OF COUNCIL. MY NAME IS J.D. PONE. I AM NOT A RESIDENT OF THE CITY OF FAYETTEVILLE. I AM YOUR CURRENT CHAIR OF THE FAYETTEVILLE CUMBERLAND PARKS AND RECREATION ADVISORY COMMISSION. WE HAVE SPENT QUITE A BIT OF TIME, SOME YEARS, SOME OF US, SEVEN, EIGHT YEARS, WORKING ON THE PROPOSED BOND ISSUE OR THE THINGS LEADING UP TO IT. AND I'M HERE TONIGHT TO ENCOURAGE YOU TO ASK YOU TO CONSIDER FAVORABLY PLACING THIS ON THE REFERENDUM ON THE BALLOT AS A REFERENDUM SO THAT THE VOTERS CAN DECIDE. NEEDLESS TO SAY, I WAS APPOINTED BY THE COUNTY. I WAS EXTREMELY THOROUGHLY DISAPPOINTED WHEN THE COUNTY COMMISSIONERS DROPPED THE BALL AND DECIDED NOT TO PURSUE THIS. I WAS EXCITED WHEN I FOUND OUT THE FAYETTEVILLE CITY COUNCIL WAS CONSIDERING GOING FORWARD WITH YOUR PORTION OF IT. THIS WILL, WILL CERTAINLY IMPROVE THE QUALITY OF LIFE FOR CITIZENS OF FAYETTEVILLE, AND FOR CITIZENS OUTSIDE OF FAYETTEVILLE. EVEN THOUGH IT WILL COST THEM, STILL WE CAN TAKE PART IN IT. I ENCOURAGE YOU. I ASK FOR YOUR SUPPORT TO PLACE THIS ON THE BALLOT SO THAT THE CITIZENS CAN DECIDE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >> THANK YOU VERY MUCH, SIR. THANK YOU FOR COMING. >> OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS MR. KERRY BERGMAN. >> MR. MAYOR, CITY COUNCIL. I AM MR. KERRY BURG. I'M IN MR. CRISP'S DISTRICT. I AM THE CURRENT CHAIR OF THE CITY COUNTY JOINT SENIOR CITIZENS ADVISEE -- ADVISORY COMMISSION. WITH OUR AGING POPULATION AND INCREASE IN SENIORS, THE CURRENT SENIOR CENTER IS NOT NEARLY ADEQUATE. IT NEEDS TO BE UPGRADED. IT NEEDS TO BE REPLACED WHICH IS A GREAT PART OF THE PARKS AND RECREATION BOND REFERENDUM. AND WITH THAT IN MIND, I WOULD URGE THE COUNCIL TO PLEASE BE COMMITTED TO ALLOW THE CITIZENS OF FAYETTEVILLE TO EXERCISE THEIR VOTE WHETHER OR NOT THEY WISH TO HAVE THE BOND REFERENDUM OR NOT. THEY CAN GET OUT AND VOTE AND EXERCISE THEIR OPINION, LET THE CITIZENS DECIDE WHETHER TO BE FOR OR AGAINST THE BOND REFERENDUM. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU, SIR. >> OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS MS. WENDY . >> HELLO. I'M WENDY MISHNER. I LIVE AT 223 HILLSIDE. AND I'D LIKE TO SPEAK TO YOU ABOUT THE POST OFFICE AGAIN. I DID READ THE OP-ED THE MAYOR WROTE. I THANK YOU VERY MUCH. AND I UNDERSTAND THERE IS A LETTER, BUT I HAVEN'T SEEN IT YET. I GUESS IT DOESN'T HAVE ALL ITS SIGNATURES. BUT WHAT I HAVEN'T SEEN AND WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO SUGGEST AND URGE YOU TO DO IS YOU HAVEN'T ASKED FOR THE BACKING OF THE CITIZENS OF FAYETTEVILLE. WORKING WITH IT, THE THEORY IS THAT WE LIVE IN A DEMOCRACY. AND THE THING THAT REALLY MOVES SOMETHING, AND THIS ISSUE REALLY HAS A LOT TO DO WITH CONGRESS, CONGRESS IS THE ONE WHO CAN FIX THIS. AND YOU'VE GOT A WHOLE WHAT OF PEOPLE IN THE CITY OF FAYETTEVILLE AND THE COUNTY OF CUMBERLAND, IF YOU COULD ASK THEM TO CALL AND TO WRITE AND TO E-MAIL, THE LETTER THAT YOU SEND, YOU'RE OUR REPRESENTATIVES AND HAVING A LETTER FROM YOU IS REALLY G. IF YOU COULD ASK THE CITIZENS TO BACK YOU UP. THAT AFTER YOUR LETTER THAT THEY WOULD BE CALLING AND WRITING AND E-MAILING. I THINK THAT -- I KNOW THAT THAT WOULD HAVE A POWERFUL IMPACT THAT ACTUALLY HEARING FROM CONSTITUENTS IN A UNITED VOICE IS THE WAY TO GO TO GET THINGS IN CONGRESS TO CHANGE. AND I WOULD REALLY LIKE TO ENCOURAGE YOU TO REACH OUT TO THE CITIZENS AND ASK THEM TO STEP UP AND I WANT TO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT THAT ISN'T SOMETHING YOU USUALLY DO AROUND HERE. I HAVE NOTICED SEVEN AND A HALF YEARS LIVING HERE IS ELECTED PEOPLE TEND TO BE VERY AUTOCRATIC, AND PEOPLE WHO AREN'T ELECTED TEND TO BE VERY DEFERENTIAL AND NOT SPEAK. SO YOU'D BE ASKING THEM TO DO SOMETHING THAT IS NOT COMMONLY DONE EVEN THOUGH WE ARE SUPPOSEDLY LIVING IN A DEMOCRACY, PEOPLE DON'T ACT LIKE IT VERY MUCH AROUND HERE. BUT I ASK YOU, I ENCOURAGE YOU TO SERIOUSLY CONSIDER IT. >> THANK YOU, MA'AM. WE APPRECIATE YOUR COMING. >> SIR, WE HAVE SURPASSED THE 15 MINUTES. DO YOU WISH TO CONTINUE? >> HOW MANY MORE DO WE HAVE, MA'AM? >> TWO, SIR. >> LET'S GO AHEAD AND SEE IF WE CAN GET THROUGH THOSE REAL QUICKLY. >> MR. JERRY. >> MY ADDRESS IS 1002 RASPBERRY ROAD. MAYOR, MEMBERS OF CITY COUNCIL, THANK YOU FOR HEARING ME TODAY. I, OTHER ORGANIZATIONS, AND MOST IMPORTANTLY THE CITIZENRY DEEM YOU ACCOUNTABLE AS I WATCH ACCUSATIONS OF RACISM REGARDING THE POLICE. TO THIS DAY WE HAVE FAILED TO FIND THIS PRESENCE. I TELL YOU NOW THAT NOT JUST RACISM BUT *** HARASSMENT ALSO IS RAMPANT WITH REGARD TO OUR POLICE DEPARTMENT. I DO NOT UNDERSTAND HOW THE CITY OF FAYETTEVILLE'S ADMINISTRATION WITH ITS MANY EXPENSIVE INVESTIGATIONS HAVE NOT FOUND YOU. IT IS NOT RACISM BUT THE MOST CONTEMPABLE RACISM IMAGINABLE COMMITTED AGAINST OUR POLICE OFFICERS. I GIVE YOU NOW OVER 90-PLUS SUCH DOCUMENTS INSTANCES AND SUPPORTED DOCUMENTATION. YOU ARE LEGALLY RESPONSIBLE FOR DEALING WITH SUCH RACISM AND *** HARASSMENT AS MANDATED BY EEOC DICTATES IT CAN BE NOT AN EMPLOYEE. OUR OWN DISCUSSION AGAINST CHROMIER FOOD SERVICES MAKES IT CLEAR THAT ONCE AN EMPLOYER IS PLACED ON NOTICE OF HARASSMENT OF ITS EMPLOYEES ARISING FROM ANY SOURCE, IT IS UNDER LEGAL OBLIGATION TO PROMPTLY STOP THE HARASSMENT, EVEN IF THIS MEANS THREATENING A CUSTOMER RELATIONSHIP. I MAKE SUCH NOTICE. JUST AS IT IS ASSURED TO THE COLORED RACE THE ENJOYMENT OF ALL CIVIL RIGHTS UNDER THE LAW AND GIVE THAT RACE THE PROTECTION OF THE GENERAL GOVERNMENT, LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS REGARDLESS OF COLOR ARE ALSO GUARANTEED EQUAL PROTECTION UNDER THE LAW. ONE CANNOT FIND A COMPREHENSIVE POLICY OBSERVED BY THE CITY OF FAYETTEVILLE DEALING WITH THESE ISSUES OR SENDING FORTH A METHODOLOGY FOR DEALING WITH RACISM AND *** HARASSMENT AGAINST OUR EMPLOYEES. CITY OF FAYETTEVILLE MUST UNDER THE MANDATE OF LAW DEVELOP SUCH PROTECTIONS FOR ALL OF OUR EMPLOYEES. I EXPECT YOU TO ENSURE THAT THIS IS DONE WITH ALL THE VIGOR AND DEDICATION THAT YOU HAVE SHOWN ENTERING THE ABSURDITIES BECAUSE IN OPPOSITION THESE INSTANCES ARE WELL DOCUMENTED AND REAL. >> LIEUTENANT, IF YOU PLEASE, PRESENT IT TO THE CITY COUNCIL. >> GIVE IT TO THE CLERK, SIR. TO THE OTHER SIDE. THANK YOU FOR COMING. >> FINAL SPEAKER FOR PUBLIC FORUM IS MR. JIMMY KEISER. >> MR. MAYOR, MEMBERS OF COUNCIL, APPRECIATE THE OPPORTUNITY TO COME BEFORE YOU. I WANT TO TALK ABOUT THE STORMWATER ORDINANCE. WE SPENT A LOT OF TIME ON THAT AND TRIED TO MAKE IT VERY FLEXIBLE, BUT AS ANYTHING IN TODAY'S WORLD, THINGS CHANGE FASTER THAN WE CAN KEEP UP WITH. A RECENT EXAMPLE IS THE STATE'S COMING OUT WITH SOME NEW GUIDELINES ON PERVIOUS PAYMENTS. WHICH ARE BIG IMPROVEMENT OVER THE DETENTION PONDS THAT WE NORMALLY SEE ON PROJECTS. THE PROBLEM IS THE WAY THAT WE HAVE THE BONDING REQUIREMENT AND THE STORMWATER ORDINANCE IS KIND OF A ONE-SHOE-FITS-EVERYBODY, AND A RECENT CASE, THE VA CENTER WE WERE LOOKING AT ALTERNATIVES TO MINIMIZE STORMWATER IMPACTS AND DOING PERVIOUS PAYMENTS. WE WERE LOOKING AT A POTENTIAL COST OF ALMOST $5 MILLION IN BONDS ALONE. BECAUSE WE HAVE TO MIMIC THE CONSTRUCTION COSTS. I THINK IT WOULD BE WORTHWHILE FOR THE COUNCIL TO GIVE STAFF SOME DIRECTION THAT WE MAY NEED TO LOOK AT MORE FLEXIBILITY IN THE BONDING REQUIREMENTS TO BALANCE THAT OUT. IF I HAD DONE THE SAME THING WITH DETENTION PONDS, I'D PROBABLY ONLY BE LOOKING AT $500,000 IN BONDS. SO IT'S A HUGE DIFFERENCE WHEN YOU ARE TRYING TO DO SOMETHING THAT THAT ACTUALLY AN IMPROVEMENT, YOU ARE BEING DOCKED FOR DOING THAT. WHICH I DON'T THINK IS GOOD PRACTICE. IT'S DEFINITELY NOT GOOD EXAMINE DEVELOPMENT PRACTICE FOR THE CITY. IF I WAS A PRIVATE INDUSTRY COMING INTO THE TOWN AND I LOOKED AT THAT AS BEING A REQUIREMENT, AND I SEE THAT $5 MILLION BOND, I AM GOING SOMEWHERE ELSE. I WOULD ASK THAT Y'ALL TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION AS WE MOVE FORWARD. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU, SIR. THANK YOU FOR COMING. >> MAYOR, I APOLOGIZE. I HAVE ONE FINAL SPEAKER. MR. CHRIS BOSTOCK. >> EVENING, MAYOR, MEMBERS OF COUNCIL. MY NAME IS CHRIS BOSTOCK. I LIVE AT 424 KINGSFIELD ROAD, FAYETTEVILLE. I AM HERE THISEFENING REPRESENTING THE -- THIS EVENING REPRESENTING THE CHAIR OF THE FAYETTEVILLE CUMBERLAND COUNTY CHAMBER OF COMMERCE REPRESENTING OUR BOARD OF DIRECTORS AND OUR 100 THOUSANDS. I WANTED TO EMPHASIZE OUR UNANIMOUS SUPPORT AND UNILATERAL SUPPORT FOR THE UPCOMING PARKS BOND LEVY. THE ENDORSEMENT CAME THROUGH THE CHAMBER'S GOVERNMENT AFFAIRS COMMITTEE, WHICH WAS UNANIMOUSLY VOTED ON BY OUR BORE OF -- BOARD OF DIRECTORS EARLIER THIS YEAR. THAT WAS ISSUED IN A PRESS RELEASE TO YOU LAST WEEK. I WISH TO SPEND THE REMAINDER OF MY TIME TALKING ABOUT THE GARNER ECONOMICS REPORT, WHICH WAS RELEASED IN MAY, AND I GAVE A BRIEF BRIEFING ON -- IN A WORK SESSION LAST WEEK, TWO POINTS ON THIS. FIRST FIRST OF ALL, ALLOWING THIS REFERENDUM TO OCCUR, AND IT'S SUCCESSFUL VOTE, WOULD ADD TO THE QUALITY OF PLACE THAT YOU SAW REFERENCED IN THAT REPORT, AND BE CONSIDERED A REINVESTMENT INTO THE ASSETS AND TO THE INFRASTRUCTURE OF OUR COMMUNITY. SECOND, I ASK YOU TO THINK BACK WHEN YOU READ THE REPORT OF THE WORKER FLOWS PIECE. YOU WOULD SEE THAT THE AMOUNT OF WORKERS FROM 2007 TO 2009 ACTUALLY GREW IN OUR REGION DURING A VERY DIFFICULT PERIOD IN OUR NATION'S ECONOMY. BUT NOTICE THAT THE NUMBER OF WORKERS THAT ACTUALLY LIVE AND WORK IN FAYETTEVILLE DECLINED WHILE THE NUMBER OF WORKERS THAT LIVE ELSEWHERE AND WORK IN FAYETTEVILLE ACTUALLY INCREASED SUBSTANTIALLY. I MAKE THAT POINT THAT WE NOT ONLY HAVE TO BRING JOBS HERE IN THE COMMUNITY. WE ALSO HAVE TO BRING THEIR FAMILIES SO THEY LIVE HERE IN ADDITION TO WORK HERE. FOR THIS AND SEVERAL OTHER REASONS, I WANT TO MENTION THAT THE CHAMBER IS IN SUPPORT OF THE PARKS BOND LEVY AS A PRUDENT PUBLIC INVESTMENT INTO OUR COMMUNITY'S RESOURCES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >> THANK YOU, SIR. >> SIR, I HAVE NO FURTHER SPEAKERS. >> THANK YOU, MA'AM. WE APPRECIATE EVERYONE COMING TONIGHT, AND THIS WILL CONCLUDE THE PUBLIC FORUM AND COUNCILMEMBERS WILL NOW MOVE TO ITEM 6, WHICH IS TONIGHT'S CONSENT AGENDA. MR. ARP? >> THANK YOU, MR. MAYOR. I'DER ASK THAT WE PULL ITEM 6.1. >> OKAY, MR. CRISP? >> I WOULD LIKE TO PULL ITEM 6.4, MR. MAYOR. >> ALL RIGHT, SIR, CAN WE TAKE THAT IN THE FORM OF A MOTION WITH THE EXCEPTION OF 6.1 AND 6.4? >> SECOND BY MR. CRISP. EVERYONE CLEAR ON THAT MOTION. LET ME ASK FOR YOUR VOTE, PLEASE. ALL RIGHT, THAT'S UNANIMOUS, AND WE WILL MOVE NOW TO ITEM 6.1. MR. ARP? >> YES, SIR. MR. MAYOR, I WOULD -- I WOULD MOVE THAT THE COUNCIL NOT AWARD THE CONTRACT FOR THE PURCHASE OF FOUR AUTOMATED SIDE MOTOR REFUSE TRUCKS. >> SECOND. >> ALL RIGHT. HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND. ANY DISCUSSION ON THAT? >> PLEASE, GIVE YOUR REASONING, SIR? >> MY REASONING IS TWO-FOLD. ONE, YOU KNOW MY POSITION ON. I THINK THERE OUGHT TO BE A LOOK AT PRIVATIZATION OF SOME OF THE SERVICES OF THE CITY, AND AS LONG AS WE CONTINUE TO MAKE CAPITAL INVESTMENTS IN TRUCKS AND THINGS LIKE THAT, WE'RE NOT GOING IT TAKE THAT OPPORTUNITY. THE SECOND THING IS, YOU KNOW, I GET REPORTS BACK FROM CITIZENS THAT THESE ONE-ARMED TRUCKS ARE NOT EFFICIENT, AND I HAVE A PHOTOGRAPH I WOULD BE HAPPY TO SHARE WITH COUNCIL AT A LATER POINT OF JUST THE LAST WEEK WHERE TRASH WAS THROWN ALL OVER A RESIDENTS' YARD BY A ONE-ARMED TRUCK. WE GOT IT RECTIFIED BUT IT TOOK SEVERAL COUNCILMEMBERS TO GET INVOLVED TO BRING IT TO THE NOTICE OF THE PEOPLE TO GET BACK OUT THERE. SO I'M JUST NOT IN FAVOR OF MOVING FORWARD ON THIS UNTIL WE HAVE HAD A CHANCE TO LOOK AT IT MORE, AND ALSO I DON'T RECALL IT BEING PRESENTED -- IT MIGHT'VE BEEN IN THE CIP. I JUST DON'T RECALL IT BEING PRESENTED. >> MR. BATES. >> YES, SIR, WELL WE DID LOOK AT PRIVATE AS -- PRIVATIZING THIS, TWICE. IT WENT OUT AND CAME BACK, AND THE PRICES THAT CAME BACK FROM THE CONTRACTORS WERE HIGHER THAN WHAT WE WERE DOING IT FOR. YOU KNOW, WITH THE ONE-ARMED BANDITS, WE HAVE OUR COMPLAINTS, AND I RECEIVED ONE TODAY FROM A RESIDENT. THEY HAD SEVEN OR EIGHT FAMILY MEMBERS AND ONE TRASH CAN. SO THEY PUT THE BAGS BY THE SIDE, OF COURSE, ONE-ARMED BANDIT DOESN'T PICK IT UP. WELL, I GAVE HER THE PHONE NUMBER TO CONTACT ON A SECOND TRASH CAN WITH SUCH A LARGE FAMILY. BUT WHEN WE LOOK AT OUR BIGGEST EXPENSE IS PERSONNEL, AND THEN THE WORKMAN'S COMP ISSUES AND THE SAFETY ISSUES, WE LOOKED AT THE ONE-ARMED BANDITS, WHATEVER YOU WANT TO CALL THEM, THE ONE-ARMED TRUCKS AS BEING ABLE TE IMPROVE CITY SERVICES WITHOUT RAISING OUR TAXES. I WILL -- I SUPPORT PURCHASING THESE VEHICLES. >> ARE THERE COMMENTS, COUNCIL? OKAY, THE MOTION ON THE FLOOR IS NOT TO AWARD THE CONTRACT FOR THE PURCHASE OF FOUR AUTOMATED SIDELOADER REFUSE TRUCKS. LET ME ASK FOR YOUR SOTE -- VOTE ON THAT MOTION, PLEASE. OKAY. THAT MOTION FAILS. THOSE IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION, MR. CRISP, MR. ARP, MR. FOWLER, IN OPPOSITION, MR. BATES, MS. APPLEWHITE, MR. HURST, MR. CHAVONNE, MR. DAVY, MR. HAIRE, MR. MASSEY. SO ANOTHER MOTION ON THE FLOOR, COUNCIL? MR. BATES? >> YES, SIR. MOTION TO APPROVE THE PURCHASE OF THE FOUR AUTOMATED SIDELOADER REFUSE TRUCKS. >> I HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND BY MR. HAIRE. ANY DISCUSSION ON THE MOTION, COUNCIL? MAY I ASK FOR YOUR VOTE ON THAT MOTION, PLEASE. OKAY. THAT MOTION CARRIES. THOSE IN FAVOR, MR. BATES, MS. APPLEWHITE, MR. HURST, MR. CHAVONNE, MR. HAIRE, MR. MASSEY. IN OPPOSITION, MR. CRISP, MR. ARP, MR. FOWLER. OKAY. ITEM 6.4, MR. CRISP. >> MR. MAYOR, I'D LIKE TO MOVE -- MOVE THE 9.2 ACRES IN CAPE FEAR BOTANICAL GARDEN WITH THE FORVISO THAT -- PROVISO THAT THE CITY INCUR NO PRESENT OR FUTURE EXPENSE AND MODIFY -- MOVE THE TOWER. >> MOTION TO MODIFY THAT? MOTION AND SECOND BY MR. BATES. ANY DISCUSSION ON THAT, COUNCIL? LET ME ASK FOR YOUR VOTE ON THAT, PLEASE. OKAY. THAT'S UNANIMOUS. THAT'S GOOD MOVE THERE. OKAY. COUNCIL WILL MOVE NOW TO ITEM 7.1, WHICH IS TONIGHT'S PUBLIC HEARING. LET ME READ THE GUIDELINES FOR THE PUBLIC HEARING, AND I UNDERSTAND WE DO HAVE A SIGNIFICANT NUMBER OF PEOPLE TO SPEAK. FIRST OF ALL, EACH SIDE WILL HAVE OO TOTAL OF 15 MINUTES TO PRESENT YOUR POSITION, WHETHER YOU ARE FOR OR AGAINST. INDIVIDUAL SPEAKERS WILL HAVE ONE TIME TO SPEAK, AND IT'LL BE LIMITED TO THREE MINUTES BY EACH, UNLESS BY PREVIOUS ARRANGEMENT A SINGLE SPOKESMAN IS DESIGNATED, IN WHICH CASE, A SPOKESMAN MAY USE THE ENTIRE 15 MINUTES. WHEN YOU HEAR THE BEEP AND SEE THE LIGHT LOCATED ON THE PODIUM CHANGE FROM GREEN TO YELLOW, THAT MEANS THERE'S APPROXIMATELY 30 SECONDS LEFT OF THE FLEA -- THREE MINUTES AND WHEN YOU SEE THE BEEP AND SEE THE TIMER LOCATED ON THE PODIUM BLINK AND CHANGE FROM YELLOW TO RED, THAT MEANS THE FULL THREE MINUTES HAS EXPIRED. WE ASK THAT WHEN YOUR NAME IS CALLED YOU COME TO THE PODIUM AND STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS LOUDLY FOR THE RECORD. AND WE WILL BEGIN WITH A PRESENTATION FROM MR. CRAIG HARMON. >> THANK YOU, MR. MAYOR, MEMBERS OF COUNCIL. FIRST PUBLIC HEARING WE HAVE BEFORE YOU TONIGHT, THE CASE P12-27-F. THIS IS PROPERTY LOCATED AT, ON WILLOWWOOD ROAD. IT'S A PROPOSED LIBERTY HILL SUBDIVISION JUST OFF OF THE KINGS GRANT DEVELOPMENT. IT'S CURRENTLY A P&D ZONING DISTRICT IN THE COUNTY. REQUESTED ACTION IS TO GO TO SF-10 IN THE CITY. APPROXIMATELY 106 ACRES ALL TOGETHER. THIS IS AN INITIAL ZONING, WHICH IS PART OF THE NEXT PUBLIC HEARING ANNEXATION PETITION. HERE YOU CAN SEE WHERE THE PROPERTY IS LOCATED. HERE TO THE NORTH OF THE PROPERTY, THIS VACANT AREA IS THE RIGHT-OF-WAY CORRIDOR FOR 295. YOU HAVE GOT PINE FOREST HIGH SCHOOL HERE JUST TO THE NORTH OF THAT. AND THEN YOU'VE GOT THE REMAINDER OF THE KING'S GRANT GOLF COURSE DEVELOPMENT HERE TO THE SOUTH. THIS PROPERTY. AS I MENTIONED EARLIER, IT IS CURRENTLY ZONED P&D IN THE COUNTY. THE OWNER HAS PETITIONED FOR ANNEXATION, CURRENTLY IT IS UNDEVELOPED. ADS YOU CAN -- AS YOU CAN SEE AGAIN, THIS IS THE SCHOOL SITE HERE TO THE NORTH THIS AREA. THEN WE HAVE GOT SINGLE FAMILY OR LOW-DENSITY RESIDENTIAL HERE IN THE YELLOWS. MORE RESIDENTIAL HERE. A LITTLE HIGHER DENSITY RESIDENTIAL CONDOS, TOWN HOME TYPE DEVELOPMENT. AND THEN THE GREEN AREA BEING THE GOLF COURSE ITSELF. THE LAND USE PLAN CALLS FOR THIS AREA CALLS FOR LOW DENSITY RESIDENTIAL HERE IN THE YELLOW. DOES CALL FOR CONSERVATION AREAS AGAIN HERE IN THE GREEN AND AGAIN THE GREEN HERE IS THE BACK END. BUT MAINLY LOW-DENSITY RESIDENTIAL FOR THIS PROPERTY. LAST YEAR IN MAY THE TRC FOR THE CITY TECHNICAL REVIEW COMMITTEE APPROVED CONDITIONALLY THE SITE LAYOUT THAT YOU SEE IN FRONT OF YOU. 104 -- 304 LOTS ON THIS PROPERTY. THAT WAS DONE PRIOR TO THE ADOPTION OF THE UDO. AND THEY HAVE A VESTED RIGHT OF TWO YEARS ON THIS DEVELOPMENT PLAN THAT YOU SEE BEFORE YOU CURRENTLY. THE BIGGEST ISSUE WITH THIS PROPERTY AS WE ALL KNOW IS THE ACCESS. THE MAIN POINTS OF ACCESS ARE THROUGH THE KING'S GRANT DEVELOPMENT. WHAT YOU HAVE BEFORE YOU ARE OTHER PLACES THAT COULD POSSIBLY BE CESSIONS. SOME NOT -- CONNECTIONS. SOME NOT NEARLY AS VIABLE AS OTHERS. ALL OF THEM ARE GOING ACROSS PROPERTIES NOT OWNED BY THE DEVELOPER OF THE PROPERTY HERE IN QUESTION. BUT THEY ARE OTHER OPTIONS OF WHAT COULD BE DONE TO SERVICE THOSE PROPERTIES. CURRENTLY, SHAW CROFT IS THE ONLY CONNECTING STREET THROUGH KING'S GRANT TO THIS PROPERTY, AND THEN IT WOULD TRAVEL ALL THE WAY OUT TO RAMSEY STREET WHERE THERE IS A STOPLIGHT. STAFF HAS RECOMMENDED THAT THE PROPERTY BE -- IF IT BE ANNEXED, IT SHOULD BECOME AN SF15 DISTRICT BASED ON THE SF15 -- FITS WITH THE EXISTING LOT SIZES IN THE AREA. THE ADJACENT LOTS IN KING'S GRANT, THE SINGLE-FAMILY RANGE FROM 11,000 TO 20,000 SQUARE FEET. SF15 IS RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF THAT. BUT THEN YOU ALSO TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION THE SMALLER CONDO TOWN HOME DEVELOPMENTS TOO THAT ARE ADJACENT TO THIS AREA. WHICH WOULD LOWER THE OVERALL DENSITY OF THE PROPERTIES ABUT THIS, THE -- THAT WE ARE LOOKING AT TONIGHT. SF15, THE OTHER SECOND REASON IS SF15 ONLY ALLOWS SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT WHICH DOES MATCH MOST OF THE SURROUNDING AREA. UNDER THE CURRENT P&D DEVELOPMENT OF THE COUNTY, ZONING, IT COULD EITHER BE DEVELOPED UNDER THEIR, THE COUNTY'S R-10 STANDARDS OR AS A P&D DISTRICT WHICH DOES ALLOW FOR BOTH MULTIFAMILY, SINGLE-FAMILY, AND EVEN COMMERCIAL. THIRD REASON THAT THE SF-15 DOES ALLOW FOR ZERO LOT LINE WHICH DOES PROVIDE FLEXIBILITY TO THE DEVELOPER IN LOT STANDARDS WITH RESPECT TO ENVIRONMENTAL CONDITIONS AND EXISTING DEVELOPMENT PATTERNS. THE ZONING COMMISSION HAD RECOMMENDED THAT IF THE PROPERTY'S ANNEXED, IT SHOULD BECOME AN AR DISTRICT OR AGRICULTURAL RESIDENTIAL. BASED ON THE AR FITS WITH THE LARGEST EXISTING LOTS IN THE AREA. THE EXISTING LOTS IN KING'S GRANT ARE UP TO 20,000 SQUARE FEET. THE AR ONLY ALLOWS SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT WHICH DOES MATCH MOST OF THE SURROUNDING AREA AS WELL. ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS OF STAFF BEFORE WE OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING? >> OKAY, ANY QUESTIONS OF STAFF AT THIS POINT? OKAY, SIR. STAND BY. AND BEFORE WE OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING, YOU WILL NOTE THERE ARE TWO DIFFERENT AGENDA ITEMS, AND THE MOTION WE ARE DEALING WITH RIGHT NOW, WE WOULD ASK YOUR COMMENTS TO SPEAK TO THE ZONING DISCUSSION, ACTUALLY THE ANNEXATION IS THE SECOND ISSUE IF WE GET TO THAT SO THE FIRST ONE IS THE ZONING. SO IF YOUR COMMENTS WOULD SPEAK SPECIFICALLY TO THIS QUESTION BEFORE COUNCIL AT THIS TIME. >> SIR, OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS MR. RICHARD WIGGINS. >> THESE ARE IN FAVOR, MA'AM. >> YES, SIR. >> THANK YOU. >> I AM RICHARD WIGGINS. I AM AN ATTORNEY HERE IN FAYETTEVILLE. MY ADDRESS IS 202 FAIRWAY DRIVE. FAYETTEVILLE, NC, 28304. I WILL BE THE SORT OF SOMEWHAT DESIGNATED SPEAKER FOR THE PROPONENTS FOR THIS MEASURE TONIGHT. AND I COME HERE OF COURSE -- IN FAVOR OF THIS REZONING PETITION. AND THE SUBSEQUENT ISSUE OF ANNEXATION, WHICH HAVE BEEN PETITIONED BY THE OWNERS OF THE PROPERTY, WHICH IS OF COURSE THE ANDREWS ROAD COMPANY. ANDREWS ROAD COMPANY IS THE OWNER OF THIS TRACT. THE NORTH CAROLINA LIMITED PARTNERSHIP OWNED BY THREE FAMILIES, LONGTIME FAMILIES IN FAYETTEVILLE. THE PAUL THOMPSON FAMILY, THE DONALD W. McCOY FAMILY, AND THE THOMAS McCLANE NOW ESTATE. AL CLEVELAND IS A GENERAL PARTNER OF ANDREWS ROAD COMPANY. THIS TRACT WAS ORIGINALLY 252 ACRES OF LAND, AND UNFORTUNATELY, IN SPITE OF TOM McCLANE'S VALIANT EFFORTS TO KEEP DOT FROM SEEING -- SPLITTING THIS PROPERTY IN TWO, THOSE EFFORTS FAILED. AND THE D.O.D.T IN 2009 CON-- DOT IN 2009 CONDEMNED 52 ACRES OF THIS PROPERTY OR 47 ACRES OF THE ACTUAL TAKING OF THE RIGHT-OF-WAY, AND SOME OTHER AREAS BECAME INACCESSIBLE BECAUSE OF THE COMBINATION ACTION OF DOT. IN ANY EVENT, THIS ROAD, I-295 NOW SPLITS THE PROPERTY ALMOST IN TWO. THERE ARE 100 ACRES ON THE NORTH SIDE OF THE EXPRESSWAY, AND 105.34 ACRES ON THE SOUTH SIDE, WHICH IS ON THE NORTH OF KING'S GRANT PROPERTY. KING'S GRANT WAS DEVELOPED BACK IN THE EARLY 90s BY MY FRIEND SAUL ROAD. WHEN HE LAID OUT THIS SUBDIVISION, HE PROVIDED THREE ACCESS POINTS FROM KING'S GRANT INTO THE ANDREWS ROAD PROPERTY. THOSE HAVE BEEN SHOWN ON THE MAP BY MR. HARMON. OBVIOUSLY WHEN HE LAID THIS OUT, HE DID IT IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE THEN CITY REQUIREMENTS, AND OF COURSE EVERYONE KNEW TO PROVIDE ACCESS TO THE PROPERTY, IT HAD TO BE THOSE ACCESS POINTS HAD TO BE GIVEN, AND EVERYONE IN KING'S GRANT KNEW OR WOULD -- OR SHOULD'VE KNOWN WOULD BE CONSTRUCT -- WOULD HAVE CONSTRUCTIVE KNOWLEDGE THAT ACCESS TO THIS PROPERTY WAS GOING TO BE HAD THROUGH KING'S GRANT. OBVIOUSLY HAD THE -- HAD I-295 NOT EVEN BEEN PUT THERE, I THINK THE ULTIMATE DEVELOPMENT OF THIS AND THE INGRESS/EGRESS PATTERN WOULD'VE BEEN THAT THOSE FOLKS TO THE NORTH NEAR ANDREWS ROAD WOULD'VE USED THAT STREET AND THE ROAD TO THE SOUTH WOULD'VE USED THE PROPERTY OF KING'S GRANT TO GET OUT TO -- FROM WILLOWWOOD TO SHAWCROFT ROAD. THAT WOULD PIVE -- WOULD'VE BEEN THE NATURAL PATTERN I THINK. AS MR. HARMON HAS POINTED OUT, IF THIS PROPERTY STAYED IN THE COUNTY AS IT IS NOW, IT COULD BE DEVELOPED UNDER THEIR P&D STANDARDS OR R-10 STANDARDS WHICH WOULD ALLOW ALMOST 600 LOTS OR INDIVIDUAL UNITS IN THIS AREA. THAT OF COURSE WOULD BE COMPLETELY UNACCEPTABLE AND WOULD NOT BE GOOD PLANNING, WOULD NOT BE GOOD PRACTICE, WOULD NOT BE SOMETHING THAT WOULD BE AN ASSET TO THIS CITY. OBVIOUSLY I'M NOT SO NAIVE AS TO NOT REALIZE AND UNDERSTAND THAT THESE FOLKS HERE FROM KING'S GRANT HAVE THE CONCERN ABOUT THE ISSUE OF TRAFFIC. WE HAVE SHARED THAT CONCERN. THE DEVELOPERS HAVE SHARED THAT CONCERN. WE HAVE HAD MEETINGS WITH CITY STAFF. WE HAVE HAD MEETINGS WITH TRAFFIC AND ENGINEERING, INFRASTRUCTURE FOLKS HERE IN FAYETTEVILLE. WE HAVE TRIED TO FIGURE OUT SOME LOGICAL ALTERNATIVE POINTS OF INGRESS AND EGRESS OF THIS PROPERTY OVER AND BEYOND ACCESS ON THESE ACCESS POINTS INTO WILLOWWOOD DRIVE AND ON TO SHOWCROFT UP TO RAMSEY STREET. WE HAVE ALSO HAD A TRAFFIC IMPACT STUDY DONE, AND I AM GOING TO SAY THAT THAT TRAFFIC IMPACT STUDY SHOWS PRETTY CONCLUSIVELY, AND THE CITY'S ENGINEERING STAFF ALSO HAS FOUND THAT WHILE THERE WOULD BE AN IMPACT ON TRAFFIC, IT WOULD NOT BE SUCH THAT IT WOULD INTERFERE WITH THE FLOW OF TRAFFIC OF SHOWCROFT ON TO RAMSEY STREET IF IT WAS PROPERTY SIGNALIZED AS D.O.T. I THINK WILL ULTIMATELY DO AT THIS POINT. AND OF COURSE THERE ARE SOME IMPROVEMENTS THAT CAN BE MADE AT SHOW'CROFT THAT WILL ALSO BE A BENEFIT TO THIS. SO WE HAVE DONE WHAT WE CAN TO MINIMIZE AND TO EXPRESS CONCERNS ABOUT THIS PARTICULAR ISSUE. BUT WE DON'T THINK THAT IT'S THE ISSUE THAT HAS BEEN PRESENTED BY THE KING'S GRANT ASSOCIATION. I RECEIVED A LETTER FROM MY FRIEND AND COLLEAGUE WALL TIPPET WHO REPRESENTS I THINK THE ASSOCIATION SUGGESTION THAT PERHAPS MUCH COULD BE DONE OR SHOULD BE DONE WOULD BE TO PUT A OVERPASS OVER I-295. THAT WAS THE FIRST I'D EVER HEARD OF THAT. I DON'T THINK THAT'S A PRACTICAL IDEA. IT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT OBVIOUSLY THE OWNERS OF THIS PROPERTY COULD EVER DO. WHILE, THEY DID RECEIVE A SETTLEMENT -- WELL, I TRIED THAT CASE AND THERE WAS A SETTLEMENT. AWARD OF $1.6 MILLION BY D.O.T. THAT WOULD NOT EVEN BE A DENT IN PUTTING THE OVERPASS OVER I-295. BUT BEYOND THAT, WHAT THE LETTER FROM MR. TIPPET DID NOT EMPHASIZE OR SHOW WAS THAT OF COURSE THEY BOUGHT 52 ACRES -- 47 ACRES OF PROPERTY FROM THESE OWNERS. SO IT WASN'T SOMETHING THEY GAVE HIM TO PROVIDE SOME TYPE OF INGRESS OR EGRESS AT THIS PROPERTY. IN DECIDING WHETHER OR NOT THIS ZONING IS PROPER, THERE IS A PROVISION IN THE ORDINANCE, WHICH IS ARTICLE 31G3 IN THE UNIFIED ZONING ORDINANCE, WHICH STATES THAT THE COUNCIL SHALL CONSIDER THE LAND'S DESIGNATED ON ADOPTED PLANS ADDRESSING THE CITY'S GROWTH AND DEVELOPMENT. THAT'S BEEN ADDRESSED BY MR. HARMON. THIS IS A LOW-DENSITY TYPE DISTRICT. WE HAVE ASKED FOR R-10 OR SF-10. WE ARE NOW AMENDING THAT REQUEST AND SAY WE CAN PROCEED WITH THIS DEVELOPMENT, WHICH IS A HIGHER DENSITY RESIDENTIAL AREA. NUMBER TWO IS IN LAND'S CURRENT USE. OF COURSE IT'S FOREST, BUT OBVIOUSLY AGAIN IT'S HIGHLY SUITABLE FOR DEVELOPMENT. THREE, THE EXISTENCE OF A PREVIOUSLY APPROVED SITE PLAN. MR. HARMON SAID THERE HAS BEEN A SITE PLAN APPROVED FOR THIS PROPERTY, AND IF APPROVED AND BROUGHT INTO THE CITY, THE PLANS IS TO DEVELOP THIS INTO A 303-UNIT DEVELOPMENT, NOT A 600-UNIT DEVELOPMENT, WHICH IT COULD BE IF IT WERE DEVELOPED IN ACCORDANCE WITH WHAT THE ZONING IS NOW. THAT IS CERTAINLY, I THINK, WOULD NOT BE SOMETHING IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE CITY, AND THE CHARACTER OF THE ADJACENT LAND ALL AROUND THIS PROPERTY IS ALL P&D, AND SO THIS WOULD BE A HIGHER DENSITY THAN WHAT IS AROUND THIS PROPERTY. BASICALLY, WE THINK THIS IS A GOOD PLAN. WE HAVE WORKED HARD TO MAKE IT A ACCEPTABLE TO -- AND BRING IT UP TO OBVIOUSLY A SUBDIVISION THAT WOULD BE CONSTRUCTED AND BUILT TO A HIGHER STANDARD THAN WHAT KING'S GRANT IS BUILT BECAUSE THE STANDARDS OF THE CITY ARE NOW MUCH MORE STRINGENT. WE STRONGLY URGE THAT THIS PETITION BE ACCEPTED BY COUNCIL. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU. HOW MANY SPEAKERS DO WE HAVE IN OPPOSITION? >> WE HAVE EIGHT SPEAKERS IN OPPOSITION, SIR. >> WE HAVE 15 MINUTES AND THEN WE WILL BEGIN WITH THOSE SPEAKERS IN OPPOSITION. >> OUR FIRST SPEAKER IS MR. LELAND NOHAGGEN. >> DOES ANYONE KNOW THAT NAME? CAN YOU SAY THAT NAME AGAIN? >> LELAND NOHAGGEN? >> OKAY, LETS BRR GO TO THE NEXT NAME -- LET'S GO TO THE NEXT NAME, MA'AM. >> NEXT NAME IS MR. SAM BRIGHT. >> MY NAME IS SAM BRIGHT, AND I AM THE PRESIDENT -- OR I LIVE IN FAYETTEVILLE. I AM THE PRESIDENT OF THE KING'S GRANT HOMEOWNERS' ASSOCIATION, AND I REPRESENT 500 RESIDENTS IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD. THE REASON THE ZONING COMMISSION DID NOT RECOMMEND SF-10 OR SF-15 IS BECAUSE THEY WANT TO MAINTAIN THE INTEGRITY OF KING'S GRANT. TYPICAL LOTS IN KING'S GRANT PROBABLY 90% OF THEM HOVER AROUND HALF AN ACRE. THEY MAY ARGUE THAT SOME OF THEM ARE NOT HALF AN ACRE. SOME OF THEM ARE .48, .46, .37. .37 IS 13-ONE-HUNDREDTHS THAN HALF AN ACRE. MORE IMPORTANTLY THEY ARE 100 FEET WIDE OR LARGER. CUL-DE-SACS. AND ON THESE LOTS YOU WILL FIND HIGH-END HOMES. 75% ARE BRICK HOMES. THE REAL ISSUE HERE IS THIS PLAT APPROVED BY THE CITY ABOUT TWO OR THREE DAYS BEFORE YOU FOLKS, WHICH YOU HAD IT UP THERE EARLIER, YOU CAN SEE THE PICTURE, YOU PROVED -- THE CITY APPROVED IT TWO OR THREE DAYS BEFORE THE UDO PASSED BY THIS COUNCIL. THIS UDO WOULD NOT ALLOW THIS PLAN TO OCCUR, I DON'T THINK, SO I SEE IT AS RUNNING IT UP YOUR CREDIT CARDS TWO DAYS BEFORE YOU FILE BANKRUPTCY. IT MAY BE TRUE, I MEAN, MAYBE LEGAL, BUT IT'S NOT RIGHT. WHAT THEY ARE TRYING TO DO ON THIS PROPERTY, I KEEP HEARING THE CITY SAY LOW DENSITY. THEY WANT TO PUT 305 LOTS ON THIS PROPERTY. 303 LOTS. AND THESE LOTS ARE .2175 ACRES, WHICH IS WELL LESS THAN EVEN A QUARTER OF AN ACRE. TWO OF THESE LOTS COULD FIT IN ALMOST EVERY KING'S GRANT LOT. ALSO, THEY ARE ONLY 70 FEET WIDE. THEY ARE 70 BY 125. VERY NARROW. IF YOU CAN JUST ENVISION BEING AT THE BEACH AND RIDING DOWN WHERE THEY CRAM ALL THOSE HOUSES TOGETHER AND YOU CAN LOOK OUTSIDE YOUR WINDOW AND LOOK IN YOUR NEIGHBOR'S WINDOW, THAT'S WHAT THEY ARE TRYING TO PUT IN THERE. MY GRANDDAD SAID IT'S LIKE PUTTING 10 POUNDS OF PUT -- POTATOES WITH A 5-POUND SACK. THE ONLY DIFFERENCE IS GETTING THEM IS WITH A STRAW. THAT'S SHAHCROFT ROAD THERE. THE NEXT THING IS WE HAVE A HOMEOWNERS ASSOCIATION. WE PROVIDE AMENITIES FOR THE NEIGHBORHOOD. WE PROVIDE A FRONT ENTRANCE. WE PROVIDE A GUARDHOUSE WITH EIGHT CAMERAS FOR SECURITY. WE HAVE COMMON AREAS. WE HAVE PARK PROPERTY. WE HAVE TO PAY FOR THIS. THIS PROPERTY IS NOT COMPELLED TO PAY FOR THIS. THERE'S ONLY 400 RESIDENCES IN KING'S GRANT ROUGHLY RIGHT NOW. THIS WILL BE ANOTHER 300 USING OUR AMENNIES. WHEN WE GOT OUR LETTER, IT IS LIBERTY HILL AND KING'S GRANT. THEY NEED TO LIVE UP TO THE STANDARDS OF KING'S GRANT IF THEY ARE GOING TO DEVELOP THIS PROPERTY. I WOULD LIKE TO ASK EVERYONE WHO IS AGAINST SF-10 AND SF-15 TO PLEASE RISE. THESE PEOPLE CARE ABOUT KING'S GRANT. THEY LOVE KING'S GRANT. THEY COULD BE AT HOME WATCHING DANCING WITH THE STARS, BUT THEY'RE HERE WITH YOU GUYS TO SHOW YOU HOW MUCH KING'S GRANT MEANS TO US. WE CAN'T ALLOW THIS. SO WE WANT YOU TO HAVE INTEGRITY, WHICH I KNOW YOU WILL. YOU ALWAYS HAVE. AND MAINTAIN THE INTEGRITY OF KING'S GRANT. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU, SIR. >> SIR, OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS MR. JAMES FLOOD. >> GOOD EVENING, MR. MAYOR AND COUNCIL. I'M JAMES FLOOD. I LIVED AT 6208 GREG COURT IN FAYETTEVILLE IN KING'S GRANT. I'M HERE AS A 20-YEAR KING'S GRANT RESIDENT AND HOMEOWNERS ASSOCIATION BOARD MEMBER REPRESENTING THE CONCERNS OF MANY NEIGHBORS. WE ASK COUNCIL FOR THE FOLLOWING. DENY THIS SF-I GUESS IT'S NOW 15, REZONING REQUEST, AND SUPPORT YOUR ZONING COMMISSION'S RECOMMENDATION FOR A MORE RESTRICTIVE AR DESIGNATION WITH THIS PROPERTY. REQUIRE ANY PROJECT DEVELOPED ON IN THIS PROPERTY TO BE BUILT TO CURRENT CITY OF FAYETTEVILLE ORDINANCES. SINCE THE ORIGINAL LIBERTY HILL PLAN GAINED PRE-UDO MIDNIGHT-LIKE APPROVAL FROM CITY STAFF, THIS WITHOUT THE DEVELOPER YET OWNING THE LAND OR APPLYING FOR CITY ANNEXATION. THAT PROCESS ISN'T PLANNING. WE BELIEVE THAT PROCESS IS ABSURD. REQUIRE FAYETTEVILLE CITY STAFF TO CONDUCT A CITY SPONSORED SHAHCROFT ROAD TRAFFIC AND SAFETY STANDARD. MANY OF US WINCED CITY STAFF TESTIFYING AT THE ZONING HEARING ADVOCATING FOR SF-10 ZONING BASED ON A PRIVATE TRAFFIC STUDY BUT LETTER ADMITTING NEVER HAVING BEEN TO SHAWCROFT ROAD. WE HAVE NO SIDEWALKS. BUT SHAWCROFT IS REGULARLY FILLED WITH DOG WALKERS, AND JOGGERS, CYCLISTS, AND MOMS WITH CARRIAGES. IF THEY VISITED, YOUR PLANNERS WOULD'VE ALSO SEEN LANDSCAPING DELIVERY TRUCKS, REGULARLY NARROWING 27-FOOT WIDE SHAWCROFT ROAD TO ONE LANE, FORCING SCHOOL BUSES, AND PEOPLE TO WEAVE IN AND OUT. BE REMINDED ALSO THAT KING'S GRANT PERMITTED BY ANOTHER FAYETTEVILLE CITY COUNCIL IN THE LATE 80s AS A PLANNED NEIGHBORHOOD DEVELOPMENT STILL HAS ROOM FOR NEARLY 100 ADDITIONAL UNITS UNBUILT AND ABOUT SEVEN ACRES OF PROPERLY ZONED PROFESSIONAL AND COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT THAT WILL ALL EVENTUALLY SPILL ONTO SHAWCROFT ROAD, EVEN WITHOUT THESE ADDITIONAL ROADS. SCHOOL BUS SAFETY, FIRE, AMBULANCE, AND POLICE SERVICES NEED TO BE CONSIDERED. OTHERS TONIGHT WILL SPEAK OF LOCAL SCHOOL IMPACTS AND ADDITIONAL INGRESS AND EGRESS POSSIBILITIES, BUT SIMPLY WE BELIEVE YOU CAN NOT ALLOW 300 ADDITIONAL HOMES TO UTILIZE AN ALREADY DANGEROUS 27-FOOT WIDE ROAD. MEMBERS OF CITY COUNCIL, WE ALREADY HAVE SERIOUS SAFETY CONDITIONS ON SHAWCROFT, AND THEREFORE ASK YOU TO SUPPORT AR DESIGNATION WITH THIS PROPERTY PLUS MAKE THIS LAND PERMANENTLY SUBJECT TO CURRENT UDOs BY DENYING THIS SF-10, 15 REQUEST. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU, SIR. [APPLAUSE] >> OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS MR. WALT TIPPET. >> COUNCIL, THANK YOU FOR THE OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK. MY NAME IS WALT TIPPET. I'M HERE ON BEHALF OF KING'S GRANT. OWNERS ASSOCIATION TWO. ITS ADDRESS IS 238 McPHERSON CHURCH ROAD HERE IN FAYETTEVILLE. 28302. WE HAVE MANY CAPABLE SPEAKERS HERE TONIGHT, AND I'LL DO MY BEST TO AVOID THOSE TOPICS THAT I KNOW THEY WILL COVER BETTER THAN I EVER COULD AND SO THE FIRST THING I WOULD LIKE TO STRESS IS THAT I DON'T THINK YOU WANT TO APPROVE THIS PETITION FOR REZONING BECAUSE IT'S NOT YOUR -- IT'S NOT CONSISTENT WITH YOUR DESIRE TO ENCOURAGE CAREFUL PLANNED DEVELOPMENT. AS YOU KNOW, KING'S GRANT HAS BEEN ON YOUR BOOKS AND BEEN THE PRODUCT OF OUR DEVELOPMENT AND OUR OWNERS WORKING WITH YOUR STAFF SINCE 1992. WHAT THIS AMOUNTS TO AS A VERY RECENTLY CONTEMPLATED DEVELOPMENT OVERWHELM 20 YEARS OF HARD WORK BY YOUR STAFF AND 20 YEARS OF RESPONSIBLE INVESTMENT BY THESE HOMEOWNERS TO OVERWHELM THESE SINGULAR ACCESS INTO KING'S GRANT. THIS PETITION WOULD UNDERMINE YOUR PLANNING PROCESS BY PERMITTING A DEVELOPMENT LARGE BY ANY STANDARDS TO OVERBURDEN UNSAFELY THE ONLY WAY TO GET INTO, IN AND OUT OF KING'S GRANT. I HOPE YOU AGREE THAT THIS IS NOT THE WAY YOU WANT TO PROMOTE DEVELOPMENT IN THIS COMMUNITY. SECOND, IF YOU WERE EVER INCLINED TO UNDERMINE THAT PLANNING PROCESS, I DON'T THINK THIS IS THE PETITION WHERE YOU WOULD WANT TO DO IT. AS MY GOOD FRIEND AND EXTRAORDINARILY CAPABLE ATTORNEY MR. WILLIAMS HAS ALREADY TOLD YOU, HE SUCCEEDED AT WINNING A $1.6 MILLION CASH AWARD BECAUSE THIS OWNER HAD A CONDEMNATION ACTION WITH D.O.T. THAT'S GREAT. EXCEPT DURING THAT SAME PROCEEDING THEY WOULD EVERY OPPORTUNITY TO NEGOTIATE CONTINUED ACCESS THROUGH SOME MEANS OTHER THAN SHAWCROFT ROAD. INSTEAD I WOULD RESPECTFULLY SUGGEST THEY CHOSE TO MAKE IT KING'S GRANTS' PROBLEM AND YOUR PROBLEM TO MAKE THE ACCESS THEY COULDVE PRESERVED PERHAPS AT SOME CASH AMOUNT. THEREFORE, WE MADE ONE SINGULAR PHONE CALL WITH D.O.T. TEE SEE IF THEY WOULD ALLOW THIS, AND IN FACT, THEY DID. AND I CERTAINLY DON'T KNOW EXACTLY HOW MUCH A BRIDGE COSTS, BUT I WOULD RESPECTFULLY CONTEND NO ONE ELSE IN THIS ROOM DOES TOO, AND THEREFORE YOU SHOULD ALLOW FURTHER STUDY TO SEE IF THAT'S A REASONABLE ALTERNATIVE BAH THAT'S WHAT'S BEEN PROPOSED TO YOU TODAY. THEREFORE, I AM HERE TO TELL YOU THAT THOSE MATERIALS THAT ARE BEFORE YOU DON'T SUPPORT DOING THIS. THEY CONCLUDE THE FIRE DEPARTMENT DOES NOT AGREE WITH THESE PROTOCOLS AND SECONDLY, -- CONTEND TO ENCOURAGE RESPONSIBLE DEVELOPMENT. >> THANK YOU, SIR. >> SIR, OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS MR. GREGORY BEAN. >> MR. MAYOR, COUNCILMEMBERS, THANK YOU FOR ALLOWING ME THE OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK TO YOU TONIGHT. MY NAME IS GREG BEAN. I LIVE AT 469 SHAWCROFT ROAD, FAYETTEVILLE, NORTH CAROLINA. AS I MADE MY COMMENTS, I WOULD LIKE ALL THE MEMBERS OF THE COUNCIL TO REFLECT BACK ON THE WORDS IN THE INVOCATION, AND THEY SAID THAT, THAT, THAT ININVOCATION ASKED US TO DO WHAT IS BEST FOR THE CITY OF FAYETTEVILLE. MY NEIGHBORS AND I ARE TAXPAYING MEMBERS OF THE CITY OF FAYETTEVILLE, AND WE ASK YOU TO DO WHAT IS RIGHT BY OUR NEIGHBORHOOD. I AGREE AND CONCUR WITH THE COMMENTS OF THE SPEAKERS BEFORE ME. AS I NOTED IN MY NOTES TO MAYOR CHAVONNE AND MR. BATES, MY CAN YOU BE, WE ARE NOT OPPOSED TO DEVELOPMENT IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD. WHAT WE ARE ASKING FOR IS SMART DEVELOPMENT, COMPATIBLE DEVELOPMENT DESCRIBED TO US BY THE PLANNING COMMISSION AS MAINTAINING THE CHARACTER AND INTEGRITY OF OUR NEIGHBORHOOD. WE DON'T BELIEVE THE PROPOSED ZONING ALLOWS THAT TO HAPPEN. WHAT WE WANT IS DEVELOPMENT THAT RETAINS THE CHARACTER AND INTEGRITY OF OUR NEIGHBORHOOD AND PROVIDES A SAFE ENVIRONMENT FOR OUR FAMILIES AND OUR FRIENDS AND OURSELVES AS WE LIVE IN OUR HOMES. MR. MAYOR, YOU KNOW THAT I SPEND MY DAY JOB DEALING WITH DEVELOPMENT AND MOST OFTEN WITH THE SECOND, THIRD, AND FORT -- H ORDER IMPACTS OF UNPLANNED DEVELOPMENT. I BELIEVE YOU AND THE COUNCILMEMBERS HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO GET THIS DEVELOPMENT RIGHT AS STATED BY MY PREVIOUS SPEAKERS. AGAIN, WE ARE NOT AGAINST DEVELOPMENT. WE ONLY ASK THAT IT'S DONE SMARTLY. I WOULD COMMENT THAT IF YOU AGREE WITH THE PETITION THAT WAS PRESENTED BY THE DEVELOPER, THAT YOU RECOGNIZE THAT NOW THE ONUS WILL BE ON THE CITY OF FAYETTEVILLE, TO FIX THE ISSUES THAT WE'VE IDENTIFIED AND PRESENTED BEFORE YOU. THAT THE SECONDARY EGRESS THAT IS SO IMPORTANT TO GET IN AND OUT OF OUR NEIGHBORHOODS. AS YOU KNOW, MR. MAYOR, I WAS TRAPPED INSIDE MY NEIGHBORHOOD AFTER THE TORNADO. I BARELY MADE IT OUT SO I COULD JOIN YOU ON THE FLIGHT AS WE LOOKED AT THE TORNADO DAMAGE. OUR ROAD HAS BEEN BLOCKED FROM A SINGLE ACCIDENT. AGAIN, I ASK THAT YOU LOOK AT THE DEVELOPMENT THAT'S PLANNED, THE IMPACT THAT'S GOING TO BE ON OUR NEIGHBORHOOD, AND I HOPE AND PRAY THAT IT DOESN'T TAKE A SIGNIFICANT ACCIDENT OR A FATALITY BEFORE FOR CITY RECOGNIZES THAT IT HAS TO ADDRESS THE SAFETY ISSUES THAT WE CREATED ON SHAWCROFT ROAD. I APPRECIATE THE OPPORTUNITY TO SHARE MY CINDERS -- CONCERNS WITH YOU, AND AGAIN AS STATED IN THE INVOCATION THAT YOU DO WHAT IS RIGHT FOR OUR CITY AND RIGHT FOR OUR NEIGHBORHOOD. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU, SIR. [APPLAUSE] >> OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS MR. WAYNE TALLEY. >> MR. MAYOR, CITY COUNCIL, THANK YOU FOR LETTING ME ADDRESS YOU. I AM ADDRESSING YOU AS A HOMEOWNER IN KING'S GRANT, AND I AM VERY CONCERNED WITH THIS PLANNED DEVELOPMENT. AS STATED EARLIER, THE UDO CURRENTLY IN PLACE SHOULD BE UTILIZED BY THIS DEVELOPMENT, NOT A TWO-DAY-IN-ADVANCE, GET IT IN UNDERNEATH THE WIRE. I THINK THAT'S KIND OF SHADY ON THEIR PART. I'M JUST GOING TO STATE IT AS I FEEL IT. I AM GOING GOING TO SAY I DON'T THINK -- THERE'S ANOTHER DEVELOPMENT PATRIOT PARK. HE'S ALREADY PUT THIS DEVELOPMENT UP. HE FAILED TO PUT THIS ISSUE UP. NEXT TO THAT THEY HAVE PATRIOT PARK ANSLY. THEY ARE ALREADY PUTTING ADDITIONAL DEVELOPMENT ON TOP OF PATRIOT PARK. HOW MANY HOMES DOES IT TAKE IN THAT AREA. NOW WITH ALL THESE HOMES IN THIS AREA, WHAT ARE THE COMMUNITY ACTIVITIES THERE? THERE IS NO COMMUNITY CENTER. WE HAVE GOT 600 HOMES, PLUS, IN THAT AREA. NOTHING FOR CHILDREN TO DO. WHO IS GOING TO TAKE THAT ON? THAT'S GOING TO BE THE CITY. WE ALREADY GOT A PARK'S BOND UP HERE RIGHT NOW. SO YOU WANT ALL THESE NEW CHILDREN RUNNING THE STREETS WITH NOTHING TO DO. IN ADDITION, I ALSO PAY DUES FOR A COMMON AREAS, IE, A POOL. ONCE THIS YARE -- AREA IS PUT IN, THERE IS NOTHING STOPPING THEM FROM UTILIZING FACILITIES I PAY FOR. THEY ARE NOT PAYING ANY DUES TO US THAT I AM AWARE OF TO SUPPORT THESE COMMON AREAS, SO THESE CHILDREN WILL BE COMING TO YOUR AREAS WHICH WILL BE ADDED CRIME, EVEN THOUGH IT'S MISDEMEANOR, MENIAL STUFF, IT'S STILL GOING TO BE THERE. THEY ARE GOING TO BE THE OPPORTUNITY FOR THEM TO GO IN THERE UNACCOMPANIED, UNSUPERVISED INTO OUR POOLS WHICH IS A SAFETY ISSUE. ABOVE AND BEYOND THAT, RECENTLY THERE WAS AN INCREASE IN TAXES. WHEN THEY REDID THE REEVALUATION MY PROPERTY TAXES WENT UP $50,000. YES, SIR, IT DID. I CAN GO GET THE PAPERWORK AND SHOW IT TO YOU. NOW, WITH THAT BEING SAID, PER TAXES, MY HOUSE IS WORTH MORE IN TAXES THAN IT IS RIGHT NOW ON THE OPEN MARKET. THAT HAS NOT BEEN ADDRESSED. WITH THESE NEW HOMES COMING INTO PLACE, MY HOME'S VAL SUE IS GOING TO -- VALUE IS GOING TO DEPROFICIENTATE. THERE IS NOTHING BEING SAID ABOUT THE SIZE OF THE HOMES. 2600 SQUARE FEET, 2400 SQUARE FEET, 1800 SQUARE FEET. THERE IS NO SENSE OF SEPARATING THEM FROM US. I PERSONALLY DISAGREE WITH THEM USING KING'S GRANT IN THEIR NAME BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT KING'S GRANT. THE VOLUES OF THE HOME ARE CURRENTLY GOING DOWN. WITH THE ADDITIONAL HOMES WE CAN'T MOVE OUR HOMES NOT FOR WHAT WE PAID FOR THEM. IT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. WE ARE LOSING PRICES NOW ON OUR HOMES. WE ARE LOSING, LOSING, LOSING. HOW MUCH DO WE HAVE TO LOSE? THANK YOU. [APPLAUSE] >> 15 MINUTES HAS BEEN SURPASSED. >> HOW MANY MORE DO WE HAVE, MA'AM? >> TWO, SIR. >> LET'S DO THOSE VERY, VERY QUICKLY. JUST MAKE SURE WE HEAR FROM EVERYONE. THE TWO REMAINING SPEAKERS. GO AHEAD, MA'AM. >> OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS MR. THOMAS DUCKWORTH. >> EVENING, MR. MAYOR, MEMBERS OF THE CITY COUNCIL, AGAIN, THANK YOU FOR ALLOWING US TO SPEAK. MY NAME IS TOM DUCKWORTH, AND I LIVE AT 917 KENSINGTON PARK ROAD KINGS' GRANT AND I AM A MEMBER OF THE HOMEOWNERS' ASSOCIATION. I AM NOT SURE WHAT I COULD AD. I JUST WANTED AN OPPORTUNITY TO GO UP IN OPPOSITION TO NOT ONLY THE ZONING REQUEST BUT SUBSEQUENT ANNEXATION REQUEST. THANK YOU. AND I WILL RECEDE MY TIME. >> THANK YOU, SIR. >> OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS MS. BETTY WHITINGTON. >> I AM BETTY WHITINGTON AND I LIVE AT 301 SHAWCROFT. I AM GLAD TO BE HERE TONIGHT TO ADDRESS YOU AND LET YOU KNOW WE ARE A NEIGHBORHOOD. PLEASE TREAT US LIKE ONE. THANK YOU. [APPLAUSE] >> CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. THANK EVERYONE FOR BEING HERE, AND ENTERTAIN ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS FROM COUNCIL. MR. BATES? >> YES, SIR. QUESTION. BEFORE MAKE ANY MOTIONS OR ANYTHING, MR. CONAN? CAN I ASK YOU A QUESTION, SIR? MR. CONAN, YOU ARE REQUESTING SF-10 PLANNING STAFF RECOMMENDS S SF-15. ZONING RECOMMENDS AR. YOU HEARD THE CITIZENS TONIGHT. >> YES, SIR. >> WOULD YOU ACCEPT AR ZONING? >> -- [INAUDIBLE] >> THANK YOU, SIR. >> ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? MR. CRISP? >> MR. HARMON? >> READING THAT I HAVE SEEN AND LISTENING TO ALL THAT I HAVE HEARD, THERE IS NO OTHER ALTERNATIVE THAN EGRESS AND INGRESS ON SHAWCROFT ROAD? >> VERY LIMITED OTHER OPTIONS FOR THIS DEVELOPMENT. YOU SAW THE MAP THAT WE PUT UP A WHILE AGO, OTHER OPTIONS THEY ALL GO THROUGH EXISTING DEVELOPMENTS OR ACROSS PROPERTIES, ALL THE PROPERTIES THAT THEY GO ACROSS ARE NOT OWNED BY THE DEVELOPER. , YOU KNOW, THERE ARE POSSIBILITIES WHICH ARE NOT VERY LIKELY POSSIBILITIES. >> LET ME ASK YOU THIS BECAUSE MR. CONAN SAID -- HE SAID HE COULD NOT ACCEPT AR. IF THIS BOARD RULED AR, AND HE DOES NOT ACCEPT THAT, WHAT IS HIS OPTION. >> ACTUALLY, I BELIEVE WE HAVE THE -- IF MR. CONIGDOES NOT ACCEPT THEIR RECOMMENDATION TO AR, IF THEY DO THAT, -- >> LET ME ASK THIS -- LET ME ASK THIS. IF THAT WERE THE CASE, HE COULD THEN WITHDRAW HIS REQUEST FOR ANNEXATION, IS THAT RIGHT, MA'AM? THAT MEANS THE PROPERTY WOULD REVERT UNDER THE RULES AND ORDINANCES OF THE COUNTY. AM I CORRECT? >> YES. >> IN WHICH CASE, IF HE WENT BY COUNTY STANDARDS, HE COULD BUILD HOW MANY UNITS ON THAT PROPERTY, SIR? >> IT'S 600-PLUS UNITS. >> 600. >> MORE THAN 600 UNITS. >> THANK YOU. THANK YOU, MR. MAYOR. >> MR. HARMON. >> YES. >> I HAVE HEARD A NUMBER OF COMMENTS ASKING THAT WE MAINTAIN THE STATUS OF NEIGHBORHOOD, CURRENT KING'S GRANTMENT HOW IS THAT CURRENTLY RATED OR AT LEAST WHEN IT WAS DEVELOPED AND I'M ASSUMING IT MAINTAINS THAT UNDER NEW CITY DESIGNATIONSES A PND. IS THAT CORRECT? >> YES, IT'S STILL A PND. >> WHICH ALLOWS FOR MULTIFAMILY AND FOR COMMERCIAL. >> CORRECT. >> SO IF WE WERE TO KEEP THE STATUS OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD SIMILAR TO WHAT IT IS NOW, THEN IT WOULD BE TO ALLOW MULTIFAMILY AND COMMERCIAL AS WELL AS SINGLE-FAMILY. IS THAT CORRECT? >> WELL, THAT'S WHAT'S IN THE CURRENT KINGS GRANT DEVELOPMENT, AND THAT'S WHAT THE COUNTY HAD ZONED THIS PARTICULAR PROPERTY. >> AND WAS THERE EVER ANY TIME AN OPPORTUNITY FOR THERE TO BE OTHER OPPORTUNITIES TO ENTER INTO KINGS GRANT BESIDE SHAWCROFT ROAD. >> THERE MAY HAVE BEEN YEARS AGO AS THE DEVELOPMENT WAS BEING DEVELOPED OR PRIOR TO D.O.T., YOU KNOW, BUYING -- >> IS MR. TIPPET STILL HERE? >> WERE YOU INVOLVED AT ANY TIME AT THAT POINT? HOW LONG HAVE YOU BEEN INVOLVED WITH KINGS GRANT? >> I HAVE BEEN INVOLVED WITH THIS PROJECT A VERY LIMITED AMOUNT OF TIME. I DON'T WANT TO SAY ANYTHING THAT WOULD MISLEAD YOU. I BELIEVE THE INITIAL PLANS WERE FILED BACK IN 91. MIGHT'VE BEEN 92. AND CERTAINLY AS MR. HARMON STARTED TO SAY, GROWTH IN THE AREA HAS IMPACTED OPTIONS AVAILABLE TO ANYONE. WE WOULD STRESS THOUGH, AS I'M SURE YOU KNOW, IT WOULD BE SOMEWHAT MISLEADING OF YOU TO THINK THAT 600 HOMES WERE AN OPTION BECAUSE IF IT WERE REVERTED TO COUNTY, IT WOULD I THINK BE RELIANT UPON WELL AND SEPTIC. AND SO AS A PRACTICAL MATTER UNDER GEOLOGY, FOR LACK OF A BETTER WORD, THE NATURAL LIMITATIONS ON DEVELOPMENT OF THE PROPERTY WOULD PROBABLY BE MORE CONSISTENT WITH KINGS GRANT. >> ACTUALLY, THEY WOULDN'T BE LIMITED TO WELL AND SEPTIC BECAUSE PWC WOULD HAVE TO PROVIDE SERVICES BASED ON THE REQUEST. WELL AND SEPTIC WOULD NOT BE AN ISSUE THERE. MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT THERE HAVE BEEN PREVIOUS REQUESTS OR THERE WERE PREVIOUS OPPORTUNITIES FOR OTHER ACCESSES AT OTHER POINTS ON KINGS GRANT TO COME IN, BUT THAT THAT WAS REQUESTED BY THE NEIGHBORHOOD NOT TO BE ALLOWED. AND THAT'S WHAT I WAS TRYING TO FIND OUT IF YOU WERE INVOLVED IN THAT PROCESS. >> MR. FOWLER, I WOULD HATE TO MISLEAD YOU. >> OKAY. THEY ARE SHAKING THEIR HEAD NO, SO THAT ANSWERS THAT QUESTION FOR ME. >> ALL RIGHT. MS. APPLEWHITE. >> THANK YOU, MAYOR. MR. BRIGHT, WHO IS THE HOMEOWNER ASSOCIATION -- SIR, ASK I ASK YOU A QUESTION? AND I DIRECT THIS TO YOU. I'M DIRECTING THIS TO YOU BECAUSE OF THE LEADERSHIP OF YOUR HOMEOWNERS' ASSOCIATION, I THINK YOU SAID 500 OR MORE RESIDENTS. CAN YOU BE CRISP BROUGHT UP THE STANDARD IF WE WERE TO VOTE AR, YOU REMAINED IN THE COUNTY, AND THE UNDERSTANDING THAT 600 PROPERTIES COULD BE BUILT. ARE YOU AWARE OF THAT? DO YOUR HOMEOWNERS UNDERSTAND THAT? ARE YOU WILLING TO TAKE THAT RISK TO SAY, CALL THEIR BLUFF AND SAY, WELL, JUST GO FOR IT? WHAT IS YOUR POSITION AS THE HOMEOWNER ASSOCIATION PRESIDENT? >> WELL, I THINK, AR IS STILL IN THE CITY IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN IS WHAT THEY RECOMMENDED. >> WHAT? CLARIFY THIS, THE AR, IF WE WENT AR, THEY WOULD BE IN THE COUNTY. CLEAR THIS UP. IT WOULD BE IN THE CITY? >> NO. I THINK THE QUESTION OF MR. CO NIG WAS WOULD HE AGREE WITH AR, AND HE SAID NO. SO THAT MEANS IT WOULD NOT COME INTO THE CITY AS AR. >> WHAT I AM SAYING IS THE ZONING COMMISSION RECOMMENDED AR, AND AR IS CITY. >> THIS ISN'T JUST THIS PROJECT, IT'S THE WAY EVERY PROJECT HAS BEEN DONE FOR THE LAST SIX MONTHS ANYWAY. THE DEVELOPER COMES AND MAKES A ZONING REQUEST. THEN THAT PERSON IF THEY GET THAT ZONING REQUEST, THEY PROCEED WITH THE ANNEXATION REQUEST. IF THEY DON'T GET THE ZONING REQUEST THAT THEY WANT, THEY DO NOT PROCEED WITH THE ANNEXATION REQUEST. SO WHAT WE'RE FACED WITH TONIGHT NO DIFFERENT THAN ANY OTHER NIGHT, YOU JUST HAPPEN TO BE HERE TONIGHT SEEING THIS IS THAT THE DEVELOPER MAKES REZONING REQUEST, WE HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO APPROVE OR DENY, IF WE DO NOT APPROVE THAT, THEN HE WITHDRAWS HIS ANNEXATION REQUEST, AND THAT CASE IT STAYS IN THE COUNTY IN PND ZONING THAT YOU CAN BUILD 600 HOUSES ON AND THEY GET WATER AND SEWER. WE'RE FACING SOME VERY DIFFICULT DECISIONS. >> I STATED IT WRONG. THANK YOU, MAYOR, FOR CLARIFYING THAT. WITH THE PND IS WHAT IT WOULD REMAIN. SO WHAT I'M TRYING TO GET AT, AND I HATE TO PUT YOU ON THE SPOT, AND NOT KNOWING HOW WE ARE GOING TO VOTE, YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU'RE A RISKY KIND OF GUY. >> I WANT TO ANSWER THAT IN TWO WAYS. THE FIRST WAY IS I DON'T KNOW HOW THIS STUFF WORKS REALLY, BUT I FEEL LIKE IF THIS MAN COULD BUILD 600 LOTS ON THIS PROPERTY, HE WOULDN'T BE UP HERE TRYING TO REZONE IT TO THE CITY. SO THERE IS A REASON THAT HE WANTS TO BE ZONED TO THE CITY. [APPLAUSE] SO I DON'T -- THERE MUST BE SOME, SOME BARRIER IN THE WAY OR SOMETHING. WHICH I'M NOT SURE WHAT THAT IS. >> CAN I ASK YOU A QUESTION BECAUSE YOU DID ASK FOR PEOPLE THAT WERE MEMBERS OF KING'S GRANT TO STAND UP. >> YES, MA'AM. >> FOR THE OWNERS HERE, IF YOU HAD THE UNDERSTANDING THAT THIS STAYS -- THIS COULD POTENTIALLY STAY IN THE COUNTY, AND COULD BE DEVELOPED TO 600, CALL A BLUFF, MAYBE, MAYBE HE WILL, MAYBE HE WON'T. IF YOU WOULD BE OKAY WITH THAT, IF YOU WOULD BE OKAY WITH POTENTIALLY THIS PROPERTY BEING ZONED TO 600 UNITS, COULD YOU PLEASE STAND UP? >> IT'S IN THE COUNTY NOW, SO IT'S IN THE COUNTY RIGHT NOW, SO THAT'S WHAT IT IS NOW. SO HE'S REQUESTING TO BE, I GUESS, ANNEXED INTO THE CITY, AND HE HAS THE PROPERTY RIGHTS WITHOUT GOING BEFORE ANY BOARD. >> HE DOESN'T ACTUALLY OWN THE PROPERTY. >> THAT DOESN'T -- THE RIGHTS ASSOCIATED WITH THAT PROPERTY, THEY CAN BUILD 600 -- WITHOUT GOING TO THE COUNTY COMMISSION, WITHOUT COMING TO THE CITY COUNCIL, THE PROPERTY RIGHTS ARE ASSOCIATED WITH THAT. >> I DON'T THINK WE UNDERSTAND WHY WE ARE HERE THEN. I MEAN, I DON'T UNDERSTAND -- AND I DON'T THINK THEY THEY UNDERSTAND WHY WE ARE EVEN HERE IF HE COULD DO THAT. SO I GUESS -- >> MR. MAYOR, CAN I EXPLAIN THAT REAL QUICK? >> WELL. >> I MEAN, I THINK THIS COULD MAKE IT CLEAR. THE REASON IF YOU HAVE A PIECE OF PROPERTY THAT YOU WANT TO HAVE DENSITY ON, TO HAVE THE DENSITY YOU HAVE TO HAVE WATER AND SEWER. UNDER THE REGULATIONS AT THE TIME THE REQUEST WAS MADE, YOU MERELY HAD TO REQUEST ANNEXATION IF YOUR ANNEXATION OR ZONING WAS DENIED THE FACT YOU REQUESTED ANNEXATION GAVE YOU ACCESS TO PWC WATER AND SEWER. SO YOUR CONTEMPLATION THAT IF IT DOESN'T COME INTO THE CITY THEY WON'T GET WATER AND SEWER WON'T HOLD UP BECAUSE PWC WILL BE REQUIRED TO GIVE THEM WATER AND SEWER. THAT'S THE ISSUE YOU ARE LOOKING AT, AND THERE YOU ARE LOOKING AT THE POSSIBILITY OF HAVING PND WHERE YOU WOULD HAVE THE POSSIBILITY FOR COMMERCIAL PLUS THE POSSIBILITY OF MULTIFAMILY PLUS THE POSSIBILITY FOR MORE DENSITY. THIS GIVES YOU AN OPPORTUNITY FOR LESS DENSITY. >> YES, SIR, THANK YOU, SIR. I'M SURE IT'S NOT SOMETHING YOU WANTED BUT I'M SURE IT. I'M CHECKING ALL THE LIGHTS HERE. MR. BATES, DID YOU HAVE SOMETHING, SIR? >> YES, SIR. >> MR. BRIGHT, I DON'T THINK ANYBODY LIKES IT ANYMORE THAN YOU DO. MR. BRIGHT, MR. BEAN, BETTY WHITINGTON, I FORGET ALL OF Y'ALL'S NAMES. I SEE AN AWFUL LOT OF FAMILIAR FACES. THIS HAS BEEN A YEAR AND A WEEK THAT YOU GUYS, KINGS GRANT FOLKS, CITY STAFF FOLKS, MR. COHEN AND HIS STAFF, WE'VE BEEN WORKING ON THIS FOR OVER A YEAR, FOR A YEAR AND A WEEK WE HAVE BEEN WORKING ON THIS. JUST A COUPLE OF THE ISSUES IS PART OF IT WAS THAT THE OLD POLICY. ALL YOU HAD TO DO WAS SUBMIT IT UNDER THE OLD POLICY. HE DID THAT. LIKE IT OR NOT, HE DID THAT. HE BEAT THAT DEADLINE UNDER THE NEW POLICY. JUST LIKE FILING YOUR TAXES. IF YOU GOT TO PAY YOUR TAXES, YOU DON'T MAIL IT IN UNTIL THE 15th OF APRIL. IF YOU GET A REFUND, YOU MAIL IT IN IN DECEMBER. THAT'S THE WAY THAT ONE WENT. WITH THIS ONE HERE, WE COULD GO AR TO APPEASE Y'ALL. IF WE MAKE THE MOTION TO AR, IF IT PASSED AR, HE WOULD JUST COME UP HERE AND SAY PULL MY PETITION FOR ANNEXATION. I DON'T WANT TO BE ANNEXED. THEN HE COULD COME BACK AND START BUILDING TOMORROW UP TO 609 UNITS ON THAT PROPERTY TOMORROW. HE DOESN'T NEED TO GO ANYWHERE ELSE. HE ALREADY GETS THE PAPERWORK WITH PWC. HE DOESN'T HAVE TO BUILD IT ON SEPTIC AND A WELL. SEE, WE CHANGED THAT POLICY, BUT WE CHANGED IT AFTER THIS WAS GOING THROUGH. WE FINALLY GOT THAT POLICY CHANGED. WE LOOKED AT SEVEN DIFFERENT EGRESSES, SEVEN DIFFERENT OPTIONS. THE ONE I NOT WE WOULD HAVE THE -- THOUGHT WE WOULD HAVE THE BEST CHANCE WITH WAS KENSINGTON PARK. WE WOULD HAVE TO DO EMINENT DOMAIN OR CONDEMNATION, TAKE THEM FROM A GATED COMMUNITY JUST LIKE Y'ALL DON'T WANT, TABLING THEM FROM A -- TAKE THEM FROM A GATED COMMUNITY, OPEN IT UP FROM THE PUBLIC. ALL THOSE TOWNHOUSES WILL BE NONCONFORMING BECAUSE THEY ARE TOO CLOSE TO THE STREET. YOU WOULD PUSH THOSE CARS THROUGH COLLEGE LAKE AND WEAVER TO GET OUT AND AROUND. BUT THEN YOU HAVE WHAT YOU DON'T WANT ON SHAWCROFT, YOU ARE WILLING TO THROW OVER ON KENSINGTON. IS LEGAL ISSUES WE WOULD HAVE TO GO THROUGH WITH THAT. YOU ARE CORRECT WHAT IS LEGAL VERSUS WHAT IS RIGHT. WHAT IS LEGAL IS HE MET ALL THE LEGAL REQUIREMENTS. SO WE CAN EITHER GO SF-15 OR WE CAN GO AR OR WE COULD DO WHATEVER WE WANT AND THEN HE JUST SAYS I DON'T WANT IT. PULL MY PETITION FOR ANNEXATION AND START BUILDING 600 UNITS TOMORROW. BY GOING SF15, WE LIMIT HIM TO 318. I MEAN, THAT'S 318 MORE THAT YOU WANT GOING THROUGH THERE BUT IT'S HALF OF WHAT HE CAN PUT THROUGH SHAWCROFT. SO THAT'S THE WAY THOSE GO. >> PUBLIC HEARING IS OVER, SIR. MR. BATES, WE KIND OF NEED TO MOVE ON. MR. CRISP HAS A QUESTION, SIR. >> WE HAVE BEEN WORKING ON IT FOR OVER A YEAR. THERE'S A LOT OF INS AND OUTS. LEGALLY WHAT WE CAN AND CANNOT DO. ALL WE ARE TRYING TO DO IS MINIMIZE AT THE BEST THAT WE CAN THE IMPACT OF THE DEVELOPMENT. >> MR. CRISP, LET ME MAKE THIS POINT. THAT MR. CONIG REVERTED BACK TO THE COUNTY STANDARDS AND BUILT 600 AND SOME UNITS, THAT TRAFFIC WOULD STILL COME THROUGH SHAWCROFT. WE WOULD RECEIVE NO TAXES. AND YET WE WOULD BE FACED WITH THE PROSPECT OF REPAIRING SHAWCROFT ROAD. WE ARE CAUGHT BETWEEN A ROCK AND A HARD PLACE. WE CAN CONTROL THE NUMBER OF UNITS ON THAT PROPERTY WITH SF-15. WE CANNOT CONTROL IT IF WE SAY AR AND HE SAYS I DON'T WANT ANNEXATION. THANK YOU. >> OKAY, SIR. THE PUBLIC HEARING IS OVER. >> MR. MAYOR, MAKE A MOTION TO REZONE TO SF-15. >> HAVE A MOTION ON THE FLOOR TO REZONE TO SF-15. MR. FOWLER, ANY DISCUSSION ON THE MOTION? MR.-- WHO WAS THAT? >> I JUST WANTED TO CLARIFY THE MOTION WOULD BE FOR INITIAL ZONING. >> INITIAL ZONING. IS THAT CORRECT, MR. BATES? >> YES, SIR. >> THAT OKAY, MR. FOWLER? MS. APPLEWHITE, MA'AM? >> IF I COULD JUST MAKE A COMMENT. THIS IS -- I THINK OUR SECOND MEETING IN A ROW WHERE WE'VE HAD RESIDENTS COME OUT AND HAD SIMILAR CONCERNS ABOUT DEVELOPMENT AROUND EXISTING SUBDIVISIONS. AS A REAL ESTATE DEVELOPER AND SOMEONE WHO CAME TO THE COMMUNITY AND BOUGHT A MODEST $85,000 HOUSE, I WAS TOLD AT THE END OF THE ROAD THAT IT WOULD JUST STAY WOODED AND PRETTY AND I DIDN'T KNOW ANY BETTER BECAUSE I DIDN'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT REAL ESTATE AT THE TIME. SO MR. WIGGINS MADE A COMMENT ABOUT SOMEONE SHOULD HAVE KNOWN THAT THE EVENTUALLY THERE WOULD HAVE TO BE AN EGRESS FROM THE PROPERTY BUT I CAN TELL YOU THAT NOW 15 YEARS LATER, I HAVE LIKE 200 TOWN HOMES DOWN THE END OF THE STREET THAT USED TO BE WOODED, AND MY SON LEARNED HOW TO RIDE A BIKE BUT NOW THERE'S 200 TOWN HOMES THERE. I MEAN, CONDOS THERE. SO I'M UNDERSTANDING HOW YOU FEEL. AND I AM JUST SAYING TO THE LISTENING AUDIENCE WHEN YOU BUY PROPERTY AND YOU SEE GRASS, YOU SEE TREES THERE, AND SOMEONE TELLS YOU 0, IT'S GOING TO STAY THERE, YOU HAVE A REALTER OR AGENT WHO SAYS IT'S GOING TO BE NICE AND WOODED. THE CAVEAT, WHATEVER YOU BUY, YOU HAVE GOT TO EXPECT SOMETHING LIKE THIS GOING IN THAT WOODED AREA. THAT'S JUST WHAT HAPPENS IN DEVELOPMENT. >> MR. ARP? >> WELL, I WOULD LIKE TO SAY HOW MUCH I APPRECIATE THE FOLKS IN KINGS GRANT. I SPENT QUITE A FEW YEARS THERE OVER ON SHAWCROFT ROAD. I KNOW IT WELL. I KNOW MANY OF YOU WELL, AND MANY OF YOU AND I WORKED TOGETHER IN A SIMILAR SITUATION OF THIS. WHEN THE BACK OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD WAS BEING DEVELOPED. AND AND UNFORTUNATELY, MS. APPLEWHITE'S RIGHT. YOU KNOW, THE DEVELOPMENT OF COMMUNITY LIKE THAT, YOU CAN ONLY ACT WITHIN THE ORDINANCE THAT YOU DEAL WITH, AND WE LEARNED THAT. WE LEARNED THAT WHEN WE NEGOTIATED THE FRONT OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND WE NEGOTIATED THE PARK SPACE AND WE DID THE BEST WE COULD TO MAKE A BAD SITUATION AS PALATABLE AS WE COULD BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY, THE BACK OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD GOT DEVELOPED, AND KINSINGTON AND IT'S A NICE AREA NOW. IT'S NICE TO SEE KINSINGTON RESIDENTS HAVE FULLY INTEGRATED INTO KINGS GRANT. THERE WAS MUCH CONCERN THEY WOULDN'T INTEGRATE INTO THE HOMEOWNERS ASSOCIATION AND THOSE THINGS AND IT'S GOOD TO SEE THAT TAKING PLACE. I THINK EVERYBODY WOULD LIKE TO HAVE A VOTER SOLUTION. EVERYBODY WOULD LIKE TO HAVE A BETTER ANSWER. MR. KOENIG, I WISH DEEPLY THAT YOU AND YOUR DEVELOPMENT GROUP WOULD WORK CLOSELY WITH THE RESIDENTS TO KEEP THE INTEGRITY OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD. IT'S A WONDERFUL NEIGHBORHOOD. AND I THINK THEY WILL BE GREAT NEIGHBORS AND PROBABLY THE BEST ADVOCATES FOR YOUR NEW NEIGHBORHOOD AS YOU DEVELOP IT IF YOU CAN WORK WITH THEM. >> OKAY, THE MOTION ON THE FLOOR TO APPROVE THE INITIAL REZONING TO SF-15. LET ME ASK FOR YOUR VOTE ON THAT MOTION, PLEASE. THAT'S UNANIMOUS. THANK YOU. COUNCIL WILL MOVE NOW TO ITEM 7.2, CONCERNING ANNEXATION OF LIBERTY HILL SUBDIVISION. >> OKAY, MR. NASH. LET'S DO IT, SIR. BACK IN SESSION. LET'S GO, SIR. THANK YOU. >> MR. MAYOR, MEMBERS OF COUNCIL, IN THE PREVIOUS ITEM, MR. HARMON HAS PRESENTED YOU WITH MAPS OF THE ZONING CASE, AND YOU'RE NOW FAMILIAR WITH THE SITE THAT WE'RE NOW LOOKING AT FOR ANNEXATION. YOU'VE INDICATED YOUR INTENTION. WE'VE INITIALLY ZONED IT SF-15. YOUR NEXT STEP IS TO HOLD A PUBLIC HEARING ON WHETHER TO ANNEX THE PROPERTY. I JUST WANT YOU TO KNOW THAT THE NOTICE OF THE ANNEXATION PUBLIC HEARING WAS PUBLISHED ON FRIDAY, JUNE 1st. AND WEE CHECKED AGAIN AND THE OWNER HAS BEEN CONFIRMED TO STILL BE THE ANDREWS ROAD COMPANY, SO WE'LL SAY THE PETITION IS SUFFICIENT. AS OF FRIDAY AND ALL OTHER STATUTORY STEPS HAVE BEEN FOLLOWED. THERE IS PLENTY MORE INFORMATION I COULD GIVE YOU. YOU GOT IT IN YOUR PACKETS, BUT AT THIS POINT DO YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? >> ANY QUESTIONS FOR MR. NASH? OKAY, SIR, STAND BY. WE WILL OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING, MA'AM. >> SIR, OUR FIRST SPEAKER SPEAKING IN FAVOR IS MR. RICHARD WIGGINS. >> MR. MAYOR, MEMBERS OF THE COUNCIL, ON BEHALF OF ANDREWS ROAD COMPANY BASED UPON THE PRIOR ACTION OF COUNCIL, I RESPECTFULLY REQUEST THAT THIS TRACT OF LAND, 105.43 ACRES BE ANNEXED INTO INTO THE CITY OF FAYETTEVILLE. >> THANK YOU, SIR. >> SIR, THERE ARE NO FURTHER SPEAKERS. >> OKAY. WE'LL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND ENTERTAIN ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS FROM COUNCIL OR MOTION. MR. BATES? >> YES, SIR, IF THERE ARE NO QUESTIONS, I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO RECOMMEND THE ANNEXATION FOR CONTINUED AREA KNOWN AS LIBERTY HILLS SUBDIVISION EFFECTIVE TODAY. >> SECOND. >> CONSISTENT WITH THE PRIOR ACTION OF THE ZONING. >> YES, SIR. >> KIND OF TIE THAT IN. YOU OKAY WITH THAT, MR. FOWLER? OKAY, SIR. WE HAVE A MOTION TO APPROVE ANNEXATION. ANY DISCUSSION ON THE MOTION? MAY I ASK FOR YOUR VOTE, PLEASE? THAT'S UNANIMOUS, THANK YOU. OKAY, THAT CONCLUDES OUR PUBLIC HEARING AND WE WILL MOVE NOW TO ITEM 8.1, WHICH IS PRESENTATION OF OUL 2012-200013 BUDGET ORDINANCE. MR. BOWER? >> GOOD EVENING, MAYOR AND COUNCIL. I WANT TO THANK THE COUNCIL FOR GIVING ME THE HONOR TO PRESENT TO YOU RECOMMENDED BUDGET. I WANT TO MAKE CLEAR THE BUDGET WE ARE RECOMMENDING TONIGHT HAS BEEN REVISED FROM THE INITIAL RECOMMENDED BUDGET BASED ON FEEDBACK FROM COUNCIL. WE WILL GO OVER THAT INFORMATION BRIEFLY THIS EVENING. JUST REMEMBER A LITTLE BIT. WE WENT THROUGH A LITTLE BIT OF A DIFFERENT PROCESS THIS YEAR, A PROCESS WHICH ENGAGED THE DEPARTMENT HEADS A LITTLE MORE DIRECTLY IN GIVING YOU INFORMATION REGARDING WHAT KIND OF RESOURCES THEY'D BE LOOKING FOR AS PART OF THE ORGANIZATION. AS PART OF THE CONVERSATION YOU ACTUALLY HEARD FROM OUR POLICE CHIEF REGARDING STUDIES THAT ACTUALLY IDENTIFIED THE NEED FOR 28 ADDITIONAL STAFF. AND THAT BECAME SOMETHING THAT WAS SIGNIFICANT INTEREST OF THE COUNCIL. WENT THROUGH FOUR BUDGET WORKSHOPS AND RESPONDED TO SEVERAL QUESTIONS OF THE COUNCIL. THAT INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE ON OUR WEB SITE TO THE PUBLIC AS WE WENT THROUGH THAT PROCESS. OF COURSE, THE TWO BIGGEST CHANGES IN THE REVISED BUDGET ARE THE IMPACTS OF GATES FOREST FOR ANNEXATION AND THE ACTION FROM THE GENERAL LEGISLATURE TO DEANNEX THAT PROPERTY. AND THEN OF COURSE THE POLICE ADDITIONS THAT I ALLUDED TO EARLIER. OUR INITIATIVES INCLUDED, ADDITIONS FOR RAMP PROGRAM. WE HAVE POLICE PERSONNEL. WE HAD THE RMS MANAGER RECOMMENDED BY THE NOBLEE REPORT, AND THEN WE HAD THE NEW POSITIONS THAT CAME OUT OF THE NEW NISH'VE -- INITIATIVE PROCESS AT THE REQUEST OF COUNCIL WHICH HAS 10 POSITIONS ADDED THIS YEAR, 18 POSITIONS ADDED OVER THE NEXT FIVE YEARS. THAT TOTAL INVESTMENT OVER THE PERIOD OF TIME WILL BE $2.8 MILLION IN ADDITIONAL INVESTMENT FOR POLICE PERSONNEL. IF YOU CARRY THAT OUT OVER 2033 THE PERIOD OVER THE PARK BOND PERIOD WOULD BE AN INVESTMENT OF $54 MILLION IN POLICE RESOURCES THAT WERE MAKING THE DECISION TONIGHT. THE OTHER PRIORITY IS LOOKING AT COMPENSATION. THE RECOMMENDED BUDGET KEEPS POLICE, PAY STEP PLAN. PROVIDES MERIT INCREASE AND PROVIDES FUNDS FOR FUTURE ALLOCATION AS WE MOVE THROUGH THE DISCUSSION WITH COUNCIL IN LATER DAYS. IT IS A BALANCED BUDGET. IT DOES NOT INCLUDE ANY INCREASES IN TAXATION AND DOES INCLUDE SIGNIFICANT INVESTMENT IN POLICE PERSONNEL OVER FIVE YEARS WITHOUT INCREASING THE TAX BURDEN ON THE PUBLIC. >> THIS IS SUMMARY INFORMATION WE PROVIDED THE COUNCIL EARLIER. AGAIN THE PUBLIC CAN TAKE A LOOK AT THE INFORMATION AND DETAIL THE CHRONICLES AND LOOK AT THE QUESTIONS COUNCIL ASKED AND HOW THEY WERE ANSWERED. THE CHANGES YOU MAY SEE IF YOU WERE TO COMPARE THIS TO THE PREVIOUS PRESENTATION WE MADE ARE BASED ON THE TWO LARGE ITEMS, DEANNEXATION OF GATES 4 AND THE ADDITION OF THE POLICE PERSONNEL OVER TIME. YOU WILL SEE THAT CHANGE MOST REFLECTED IN THE FUND BALANCE NUMBER ON THE THIRD COLUMN HERE. 3.9 PROJECTED FUND BALANCE USE. THAT NUMBER WAS AROUND 2-YILL -- 2 MILLION WHEN WE FIRST RECOMMENDED THE BUDGET. SO THAT HAS GONE ON. IT'S BELOW THE PROJECTED FUND BALANCE OF THE LAST BUDGET. SO WE ARE PUTTING OURSELVES IN A BETTER FINANCIAL POSITION THAN WE WERE LAST YEAR AT THIS TIME. OPERATING EXPENDITURES. JUST A SUMMARY THERE. SLIGHT DIFFERENCE AGAIN THOSE DIFFERENCES ARE LESS EXPENDITURES FOR GATES 4. A LITTLE MORE EXPENDITURES FOR THESE. ALSO INCLUDED IN THE BUDGET PROPOSAL TONIGHT IS A PUBLIC WORKS COMMISSION BUDGET AND THIS IS THE SUMMARY OF THOSE. WE HAVE THE FLEET MAINTENANCE INTERNAL SERVICE FUND. THEY ARE AT $7 MILLION. WATER AND WASTEWATER AND OF COURSE ELECTRICAL OPERATIONS FUNDS FOR A TOTAL BUDGET OF $343 MILLION. THIS IS A SUMMARY OF SOME OF THE WAYS THAT THE PUBLIC WORKS COMMISSION BUDGET SUPPORTS THE CITY'S FUNDING. THE ONE NUMBER THAT HAS CHANGED THERE IS THAT TOP NUMBER WHICH IS PART OF THE CHANGE IN THE WAY WE'RE FUNDING POLICE PERSONNEL OVER TIME. AND THEN THE RECOMMENDATION IS WE GO AHEAD AND ADOPT THE BUDGET ORDINANCE, THE CAPITAL AND INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY PLANS, THE CAPITAL PROJECT ORDINANCE AND AMENDMENTS THERE TOO. IF THERE ARE ANY QUESTIONS, I WILL DO MY BEST TO ANSWER THEM. >> SIR, THANK YOU ON BEHALF OF THE COUNCIL. WE WANT TO THANK THE STAFF FOR THEIR HARD WORK IN PULLING THIS TOGETHER AND I KNOW WE DO HAVE SOME ADDITIONAL ITEMS WE WE WOUD LIKE TO DISCUSS AND WE TALKED BEFORE THE MEETING THAT EVERY CAN YOU BE IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO PROPOSE SOME CHANGES, WE WANT TO DISCUSS THAT FULLY AND THEN KIND OF SEE WHERE THE COUNCIL IS ON THAT PARTICULAR ITEM AND THEN WE WILL GO THROUGH AS MANY AS PEOPLE HAVE AND THEN AT THE END WE WILL WRAP EVERYTHING INTO ONE KIND OF OMNIBUS BILL. HOWEVER YOU SPELL THAT. AND WE'LL START WITH MR. CRISP. SIR? >> MR. BOWER, IN THE CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PLANS, THE ITEM OF LEGEND AVENUE, $125,000 IN THIS FISCAL YEAR. WHAT WILL THAT $125,000 BE USEDD FOR? >> THE $125,000 IS A NEW SIGNAL AT LEGEND AND SYCAMORE DAIRY. >> MS. APPLEWHITE. >> MR. BAUER, AT OUR LAST WORK SESSION, WE RECEIVED A BRIEFING FROM HUMAN RELATIONS IN REGARDS TO THE LIMITED ENGLISH PROFICIENCY PROGRAM THAT WE'RE IMPLEMENTING HERE IN THE CITY TO REACH OUT TO OUR HISPANIC CITIZENS. I DID SEND YOU AN E-MAIL LATE, IT WAS IN REGARDS TO ANY FUNDING ALLOCATIONS FOR PRINTING BECAUSE PART OF THAT OUTREACH WOULD BE PROVIDING HANDOUTS OF OUR CORE SERVICES AND PRINCEOUTS AND WHEN I SPOKE TO HUMAN RELATIONS, I DON'T SEE HIM HERE, HE INDICATED HE HAD A CONCERN THAT THAT IF THERE WAS ANY FUNDING FOR PRINTING SO MY QUESTION IS TO YOU, IS THERE SOMEWHERE IN THE BUDGET THAT FUNDS HAVE BEEN ALLOCATED TO ASSIST OUR HUMAN RELATIONS DEPARTMENT UNDER TITLE 6 OF THE U.S. CODE. >> WELL, ACTUALLY, ANSWERING THE QUESTION THAT YOU JUST ASKED, ARE THERE FUNDS AVAILABLE TO ASSIST THEM IN IMPLEMENTING THE LEP, THE ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION IS, YES, WE DO HAVE FUNDS AND A NUMBER OF OPERATIONS TO ACTUALLY HIRE INTERPRETERS IF NECESSARY CONSISTENT WITH THE PLAN. WE ALSO AS DISCUSSED WITH COUNCIL LOOKING TO PRIDE THE SERVICES AT NO COST -- PROVIDE THOSE SERVICES AT NO COST. WE HAVE A LOT OF EMPLOYEES WHO VOLUNTEER TO INTERPRET AND WE ARE CATALOGING THAT RESOURCE. IT'S A FREE -- THEY ARE NOT DOING THEIR REGULAR JOB, BUT THAT'S THE RESOURCE WE WILL USE FIRST BUT WE DO HAVE ADDITIONAL RESOURCES FOR INTERPRETIVE SERVICES IN EACH OPERATIONAL BUDGET. >> HIS CONCERN IS THAT IT WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO COME FORWARD WITH A PRINTING BUDGET. I WILL GET RIGHT TO IT. JUST AS AS THE COUNTY HAS, OTHER MUNICIPALITIES HAVE, ACTUAL BROCHURES IN SPANISH. YOU WALK IN, PICK ONE UP. HIS CONCERN WAS THERE HAD NOT BEEN ANY MONEY SPECIFICALLY ALLOCATED THAT HE KNEW OF FOR PRINTING COSTS. AND WHAT I AM TRYING TO FIGURE OUT IS THERE PRINTING BUDGET THAT HE CAN LIKE PULL FROM OR WOULD YOU SAY THAT MONEY WOULD NEED TO BE ALLOCATED FOR PRINTING COSTS TO SUPPORT LEP? >> ONE OF THE QUESTIONS YOU ASKED DURING THE LAST WORK SESSION, CAN YOU BE WAS AN ESTIMATE FOR THE COST OF DOING TRANSLATION OF SIMILAR DOCUMENTS. I WOULD EXPECT THAT ESTIMATE WOULD INCLUDE PRINTING. WE HAVE NOT COMPLETED THAT TAX TAX -- TASK YET. >> SO IS THE PLAN HE IS GOING TO COME BACK TO YOU. I HAVE GOTTEN THE ESTIMATE, THIS IS THE PRINTING COST AND YOU ARE GOING TO MAYBE TRANSFER SOMETHING OVER FROM THE GENERAL FUND TO SUPPORT THAT? >> WE WOULD HAVE A CONVERSATION WITH COUNCIL. DURING OUR CONVERSATION COME BACK TO COUNCIL WITH THE COST ESTIMATE AND PROVIDE THE COUNCIL AN OPPORTUNITY TO GIVE US FURTHER DIRECTION ABOUT WHETHER WE SHOULD MOVE FORWARD WITH FUNDS TO MAKE THAT HAPPEN. >> BUT IF THE COUNCIL SAYS YEAH, WE WANT TO DO THE RIGHT THING, WE WANT TO PRINT SOME THINGS OUT. YOU WOULD GO INTO OUR SAVINGS ACCOUNT WITH LISA AND FIND US SOME MONEY? >> I WOULD BRING YOU THE OPTIONS TO DO THAT, CAN YOU BE, YES. >> THAT'S FINE. THANK YOU. >> ANYONE HAVE ANY OTHER DIRECTION ON THE BUDGET? >> YES, SIR? >> OKAY, MR. CRISP. >> MY UNDERSTANDING IS OBVIOUSLY WE HAVE A PRINT SHOP, IF YOU WILL. AND THEN EACH DEPARTMENT PAYS FOR THE PRINTING, IS THAT CORRECT? >> THAT'S CORRECT. >> OKAY. THANK YOU. >> MR. MASSEY? >> YEAH, I JUST WANTED TO REMIND EVERYONE THAT THE BUDGET IS IN FACT A PLAN. IF TIME GOES ON WE FIND WE HAVE ADDITIONAL NEEDS THE BOTTOM LINE IS WE WILL MAKE ADJUSTMENTS AND CHANGES THAT WILL AS BEST WE CAN ADDRESS THOSE POSITIVE THINGS THAT WE TALK ABOUT. WE CANNOT FORESEE EVERYTHING THAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN TOMORROW. I WANT TO THANK KRISTOFF, CHIEF BERGMAN, ALL OF YOU, FOR THE WORK YOU HAVE DONE IN PUTTING THIS TOGETHER AND I WILL BE SUPPORTING IT. MAY I ASK FOR A MOTION FROM COUNCIL? >> YES, SIR. MOTION TO MOVE THE ADOPTION AS PRESENTED. >> IS THERE A SECOND? THANK YOU. MR. MASSEY. ANY DISCUSSION OF THE MOTION? LET ME ASK FOR YOUR VOTE, PLEASE. OKAY, THAT MOTION CARRIES. THOSE IN FAVOR, MR. CRISP, MR. BATES, MR. HURST, MR.TIA CHAVONNE, MR. DAVY, MR. HAIRE, MR. MASSEY, MR. FOWLER, IN OPPOSITION, MS. APPLEWHITE. OKAY, ITEM 8.2, PARKS AND REC RESOLUTION FOR PRELIMINARY AUTHORIZATION FOR PARK REFERENDUM. MR. GIBSON HERE? >> YES. YOU DIDN'T BUY A NEW SUIT FOR TONIGHT'S PRESENTATION, DID YOU? ALL RIGHT. >> OKAY, MR. MAYOR, COUNCIL, I APPRECIATE THIS OPPORTUNITY. COME BACK BEFORE YOU. WHAT I WANT TO DO TONIGHT IS I'VE CHANGED THE POWERPOINT PRESENTATION A LITTLE BIT TO GIVE YOU A LITTLE BIT MORE HISTORY TO GIVE YOU MORE BASIS OF WHERE WE CAME FROM. AND HOW WE GOT THERE. SO I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT YOU FOLLOW ME. WHAT YOU HAVE ON THE SCREEN NOW, THERE'S A BASIC, THE FIVE BASIC THE NEIGHBORHOOD AIOTIC CENTERS, THE COMPLEX, THE CAPE FEAR RIVER PARK, AND THE SPORTS COMPLEX. >> BACK IN 2006 WITH WHEN THE TO DISPARMTS, THE COUNTY AND THE -- DEPARTMENTS, THE COUNTY AND THE DISTRICT, THE CITY, THEY GOT TOGETHER THEY WANTED TO DO A COMPREHENSIVE MASTER PLAN, SO IN 2006 THAT WAS ADOPTED. BY BOTH BOARDS. THE COUNTY COMMISSION AND THE CITY COUNCIL. AND HOW WE GOT TO THAT POINT WAS THE FIVE PUBLIC MEETINGS, THE COUNTYWIDE TELEVISION SURVEYS, INTERVIEWS AND STAKEHOLDERS. ALL OF THAT CAME UP TO $82 MILLION. BUT THE MOST IMPORTANT THING THAT CAME OUT OF THIS MEETING WAS WHAT THEY RECOMMENDED AND HOW THEY BROKE DOWN THAT $82 MILLION LAND ACQUISITION, SPECIAL USE FACILITIES, THAT ALL CAME UP TO THIS LARGE NUMBER. THERE IS A $47,000 ACTION PLAN, FIVE-YEAR ACTION PLAN DONE, AND WHAT WE DID, PARKS AND RECREATION AND ITS PARTNERS, IS THAT WE TOOK THAT EXECUTIVE SUMMARY AND SAID OKAY, WHAT CAN WE DO THAT HAD THE MOST MAJOR IMPACT ON THE COMMUNITY AND PROVIDE THE GREATEST SERVICE FOR THE LEAST AMOUNT OF -- WITH THE MOST *** FOR OUR BUCK. AS YOU KNOW, THE COUNTY DECIDED NOT TO PURSUE THEIR END, AND WE JUST, WHAT MR. PONE SAID, WE JUST APPRECIATE THE FACT THAT THE CITY COUNCIL WOULD TAKE THIS UP AND VENTURE INTO THIS FOR US. SO WE MOVED ON WITH WHAT WE BELIEVE THE ELECTED OFFICIALS OF THE CITY AND WHAT WOULD GIVE US THE MAJOR IMPACT IS OUR MULTIPURPOSE AQUATIC CENTER WITH A SENIOR CENTER, FAMILY AQUATIC CENTERS, THE CAPE FEAR RIVER PARK, THE SKATE PARK, NEIGHBORHOOD COMMUNITY PARKS, GREENWAYS, EXISTING ACCESS TO PARKS AND BUILDING RENOVATION, PARKLAND ACQUISITION AND PLANNING AND DESIGN. ONE OF THE THINGS I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT YOU UNDERSTAND IS WHEN WE DID THIS PLAN, WE WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT THERE WAS A REASON TO SAY YES. THAT WE WENT THROUGH EVERYTHING THAT WE COULD POSSIBLY DO TO MAKE SURE THAT THE DEPARTMENT HAD COME UP WITH ANY EXISTING PROBLEMS NAT WOULD CAUSE US ISSUES TO NOT COME FORWARD. WE DID A STRUCTURAL PLAN, AND IN THE STRUCTURAL PLAN THAT HAD PROJECT GOALS, PROJECT SCOPE, ACTIVITIES, CONSTRUCTION COSTS, OPERATIONAL COSTS, POTENTIAL FEES, COST RECOVERY, TARGET UDEMOGRAPHICS, PRIMARY AND SECONDARY SERVICE, AND WE PRESENTED THAT IN A BOOK THAT WE GAVE TO THE COMMISSIONERS AND THE COUNCIL PROBABLY ABOUT MAYBE THREE MONTHS AGO. THAT HAD A BREAKDOWN OF ALL THAT STRUCTURAL PLAN PER ITEM. SO WE WOULD ANTICIPATE PROBABLE CAUSE. THIS IS A COLLAGE OF WHAT WE THINK THOSE FACILITIES WOULD LOOK LIKE. YOU CAN SEE THAT EVERYTHING THAT WE HAVE, THE TENNIS CENTER JUST TO GIVE PEOPLE A VIEW OF WHAT WE THINK WE NEED IN THIS COMMUNITY. THERE'S MORE PICTURES OF THE SKATEBOARD PARK, EXISTING PARK, RIVERWAYS. THIS SLIDE I THINK IS ONE OF THE MOST SIGNIFICANT SLIDES THAT WE HAVE. IT GIVES US TREMENDOUS INFORMATION FROM THE 2010 CENSUS PLAN. ONE OF THE MOST SIGNIFICANT THINGS I HEAR FROM THE COMMUNITY IS IT'S A GRANDIOSE PLAN. IT'S TOO BIG. WELL, IF YOU LOOK AT THE NUMBERS ON THE CENSUS PLAN, AND THIS IS ONE OF MY LITTLE PET PEEVES, AND I, I SAY THIS TO A LOT OF MY FRIENDS IS THAT FAYETTEVILLE IS A TOWN THAT CITIES GREW UP AROUND AND IF YOU DON'T PAY ATTENTION TO WHAT YOU ARE DOING OVER THE NEXT FOUR TO FIVE YEARS YOU WILL FIGURE OUT YOU ARE IN A CITY AND YOU WON'T HAVE ANY AMENITIES THAT CITIES HAVE. AND IF YOU LOOK AT WHAT WE DID WHEN WE WERE GOING THROUGH THIS PLAN, WITH THE 20 CENSUS NUMBERS, 2010 CENSUS NUMBERS, YOU CAN SEE THAT CHILDREN AND YOUTH AGES 20 -- 0-20 NUMBER ABOUT 105,000 IN THIS COMMUNITY. FAMILY FORMING, 21 TO 44 IS 111,000. MATURE ADULTS, 45 TO 64, 70,000 AND THE RETIREMENT AGE IS 31,000 PEOPLE. AND THAT NUMBER IS ONLY GOING TO GO UP. I MEAN, OVER THE LAST COUPLE OF MONTHS, JUST HAVING THE INFORMATION WE WENT OVER WITH KINGS GRANT, PEOPLE DON'T BUILD OVER 300-HOME SUBDIVISIONS AND NOBODY MOVE INTO THEM. THAT JUST DOESN'T HAPPEN. PEOPLE DON'T SPEND THAT KIND OF MONEY SO SOMEWHERE THESE PEOPLE ARE GOING TO COME AND LIVE IN THESE COMMUNITIES. IF YOU LOOK AT THE POPULATION WITHIN THE CITY, YOU CAN SEE WE ARE 208,000 FAYETTEVILLE CUMBERLAND POPULATION. THE TOTAL IS 319,000. AND THE NUMBER THAT REGIONAL POPULATION NUMBER IS THE ONE THAT I ALWAYS POINT TO THE MOST WHEN I AM TALKING TO PEOPLE IS THAT THERE ARE 47,000 PEOPLE WHO LIVE ON OUR BORDERS WHO USE OUR SERVICES. WHO DON'T PAY TAXES IN THE CITY. AND IF YOU LOOK AT THE TOTAL NUMBER FROM A REGIONAL STANDPOINT, AND THE, YOU HEAR THAT MORE IN THE NEWS NOW THAN YOU HEAR ANYPLACE ELSE IS FAYETTEVILLE IS BECOMING A REGIONAL SERVICE PROVIDER. AND PARKS AND RECREATION WILL BE NO LESS THAN THAT EITHER. WE WILL BECOME THE REGIONAL PROVIDER FOR THIS COMMUNITY, AND YOU LOOK AT THAT NUMBER AND THAT NUMBER IS 367,000. AND THIS WAS 2010. I AM PRETTY SURE IT'S GONE UP SINCE THEN. HOUSEHOLDS WITH CHILDREN, OUT OF THAT TOTAL NUMBER, THERE'S 86,000 THAT HAVE CHILDREN. NONFAMILY FORMING IS 32. TOTAL HOUSEHOLDS, 119,000 AND YOU CAN SEE WHAT I'VE MENTIONED BEFORE IS THAT, THAT 5 TO 10-MILE RADIUS OF PEOPLE WHO JUST SIT ON OUR BORDERS. ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE'VE DONE IS THAT OVER THE PAST PROBABLY 10, MAYBE, MAYBE 12 YEARS, THE CITY HAS UNDERTAKEN LAND ACQUISITIONS FOR OUR FUTURE PARKS BASED ON WHAT WE WENT THROUGH IN THE MASTER PLAN, AND THIS NEXT SLIDE SHOWS WHERE WE BELIEVE THESE FACILITIES AND THE IMPROVEMENTS AND RENOVATIONS SHOULD GO. YOU CAN SEE THAT WE'VE -- WE BELIEVE THAT WE'VE PUT THEM IN AREAS BASED ON WHERE OUR LAND PURCHASES WERE AND WHERE WE BELIEVE THE FUTURE SHOULD GO BASED ON THE MASTER PLAN. THROUGHOUT THE CITY, ON OUR MAJOR THUR OFARES AND ARTERIES, WHERE OUR DENSITY HAS SHOWN UP IN OUR POPULATIONS, ESPECIALLY OUT IN THE WESTERN PART. IF YOU LOOK AT THE MAP TO THE WEST AND THE 314 AND THE 304, AND THE 306 ZIP CODES, YOU CAN SEE THAT WE HAVE THREE POOLS, TENNIS CENTER WE BELIEVE THAT WE COULD LOCATE, AND THREE NEIGHBORHOOD PARKS BASED IN THOSE AREAS. CURRENTLY NOW WE'RE WORKING ON A SPORTS COMPLEX OUT WITH THE SCHOOL SYSTEM OUT ON CENTURY CIRCLE, AND I I THINK ONE OF THE THINGS THAT HAPPENS IS THAT OUR SCHOOL PARTNERSHIP DOESN'T GET A LOT OF CREDIT. PEEP DON'T KNOW ABOUT IT UNTIL WE DO SOMETHING. I HAD A PHONE CALL THE OTHER DAY FROM A GENTLEMAN WHO WANTED TO KNOW WHAT THEY HAVE ACCESS FROM PARKS AND RECREATION TO THE NEW CENTURY CIRCLE MIDDLE SCHOOL GYMNASIUM, AND I TOLD HIM WITHOUT A DOUBT WE WOULD HAVE THAT SACK SES -- ACCESS. SO AS FAR AS THE AMENITIES IN OUR MOST HIGHLY DENSED AREA, OUR GROWING AREA, WE ARE PAYING ATTENTION TO IT AND WE ARE ADDING AS MANY AMENITIES AS WE CAN AS FAST AS WE CAN. YOU CAN LOOK AT -- THIS IS ANOTHER MAP THAT I WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT PEOPLE UNDERSTOOD. THIS IS OUR VICINITY MAP FOR OUR OUTDOOR POOLS AND WHAT THOSE CIRCLES REPRESENT IS A SIX-MILE RADIUS. THEN FROM THE CENTER OF THE CIRCLES FROM ANY POINT ON THAT, ON THAT MAP ON THE MAP YOU HAVE THERE, YOU SHOULD ONLY BE 1.5 MILES AWAY FROM ANY NEIGHBORHOOD POOL OR AQUATICS FACILITY IN THE CITY LIMITS. THE SMALL PAINTISH CIRCLE, I HOPE -- PINKISH CIRCLE, I HOPE I GOT THE COLOR RIGHT, IS OUR EXISTING POOL OVER AT SEABROOK PARK OFF OF LANGDON STREET, BUT YOU CAN SEE -- AND JUST TO GIVE YOU A QUICK UNDERSTANDING, OUR NORMAL SERVICE AREA FOR RECREATION CENTER IS 1.5 MILES IN THE URBAN AREA. WHAT WE DID WAS SAY, WELL LET'S DOUBLE THAT FOR A POOL SO WE CAN GET THAT DENSITY UP A LITTLE BIT MORE SO WE CAN SERVICE MORE PEOPLE. SO WE CAN HAVE THAT KIND OF ECONOMIC IMPACT. SO WE WENT UP TO 3.5. SO YOU HAVE THAT AROUND THE NEIGHBORHOOD POOLS IF WE ARE BLESSED TO BUILD AROUND THIS COMMUNITY. THIS IS ANOTHER PROPOSED FACILITY RENOVATIONS WE WOULD UPGRADE. BRENTWOOD SCHOOL PARK IS IN THE WESTWOOD COMMUNITY IN THE HIGHLY DENSED AREA. CLARK PARK, DOROTHY GILMORE, SPECIAL NEEDS FACILITY. THE MARTIN LUTHER KING PARK, MASSEY HILL RECREATION AREA. SEABROOK PARK WE WOULD WANT TO MAKE SOME MORE UPGRADES TO THAT NEIGHBORHOOD POOL SO WE COULD HANDLE THAT, THE STRESS THAT IT HAS NOW WITH ITS PARTS BREAKING DOWN. THIS IS WHAT OUR INITIAL PROPOSAL WAS WITH THE COUNTYWIDE PROPOSAL. YOU CAN SEE THE NUMBER IS $65 MILLION. WE HAVE SINCE GONE BACK AND REDID THAT AND HERE NOW YOU HAVE BOND CONSTRUCTION COSTS FOR A CITY PROJECTS. YOU CAN SEE THAT THAT NUMBER NOW IS $10 MILLION BASICALLY, 10 MILLION LESS AT AROUND $55 MILLION AND YOU CAN SEE WHAT WE PROPOSED OUR CONSTRUCTION -- PROBABLY CONSTRUCTION COSTS WOULD BE. FOR THOSE FACILITIES THROUGHOUT THE CITY. THIS IS A VERY GOOD MAP, I MEAN, A VERY GOOD SLIDE. IT HELPS PEOPLE SORT OF UNDERSTAND WHAT THEIR COMMITMENT IS TO THIS BOND PROPOSAL. I HAD PHONE CALLS ALL WEEK FROM CITIZENS SAYING YOU ARE ASKING ME TO SPEND 46 MILLION. I SAID NO MA'AM, WE DON'T EXPECT YOU TO PAY $46 MILLION. IF YOU LOOK AT THE SLIDE, THE PROPERTY VALUE IF YOU HAVE A $75,000, 100 THOUSAND DOLLAR HOME. YOUR ANNUAL TAXES WOULD BE ABOUT $16 TO $22 A YEAR. YOUR LIFETIME DEBT OVER 20 YEARS ROUGHLY $427 OVER THE COURSE OF THE LIFE OF THIS BOND BASED ON YOUR, YOUR PROPERTY VALUE FOR HOMEOWNER. ONE OF THE THINGS I WANTED TO MAKE SURE THE COUNCIL AND PUBLIC WERE LISTENING OR LOOKING AT THIS PRESENTATION NOW, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WHEN WE WENT INTO THIS IS WE WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT THE FACILITIES THAT WE BUILT HAD SOME KIND OF ECONOMIC IMPACT AND THAT THEY COULD SUPPORT THEMSELVES TO SOME DEGREE. WE BELIEVE THAT WE COULD PUT TOGETHER FACILITIES THAT THE WHOLE CITY CAN USE THAT THE CONVENTIONS BUREAU CAN GO OUT FOR US AND MARKET THAT WE CAN PUT HEADS IN BEDS. AND ALSO PROVIDE A SERVICE THROUGHOUT THE COMMUNITY OF A HIGHER LEVEL THROUGHOUT OUR COMMUNITY. SO I DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH I CAN EMPHASIZE THAT, BUT I DON'T BELIEVE THAT WE SHOULD ASK TAXPAYERS TO CONTINUE JUST TO FUND ANOTHER WRECK CENTER, THAT WE SHOULD BUILD THINGS THAT SUPPORT THEMSELVES, AND WE BELIEVE WE HAVE DONE THAT WITH THESE FIVE MAJOR PROJECTS. WHAT WE WOULD LIKE TO DO TONIGHT IS RECOMMEND THE COUNCIL MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE PROPOSED RESOLUTION TO DIRECT STAFF TO PUT A GENERAL OBLIGATION BOND REFERENDUM TO FINANCE VARIOUS PARKS AND RECREATION IMPROVEMENTS FOR THE CITY ON THE BALLOT IN FEBRUARY 2013. AND I WILL BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS. >> I AM SURE WE HAVE SOME. SIR, I THINK MS. DAVY, THEN MR. ARP. >> THANK YOU, MR. GIBSON. THANK YOU FOR YOUR PRESENTATION. STAFF AND NUMEROUS CONVERSATIONS THAT WE'VE HAD, BASED ON THE LAST SLIDE HERE, WHICH IS A RECOMMENDATION, I WOULD LIKE TO DIRECT STAFF TO PLACE A GENERAL OBLIGATION BOND REFERENDUM TO FINANCE VARIOUS PARKS AND RECREATION IMPROVEMENTS FOR THE CITY ON THE BALLOT IN FEBRUARY OF 2013. >> MS. DAVEY, IF WE CAN JUST ASK -- I THINK OTHER COUNCILMEMBERS MIGHT HAVE QUESTIONS SO WE WILL COME BACK TO YOU, MA'AM. SORRY. THAT'S OKAY. >> JUST PUTTING THE MOTION OUT THERE. >> MR. ARP, QUESTION, SIR? >> FIRST OFF, I WANT TO SAY THANKS TO MICHAEL AND EVERYBODY THAT WORKS ON THIS PLAN AND THERE'S A LOT THAT'S GONE INTO IT. AND I WANT TO THANK MIKE AND MR. KRISTOFF FOR THEIR TOUR FRIDAY. I APPRECIATE YOU TAKING THE TIME TO DO NAT. THAT. IN 2006 WHEN THIS WAS PUT TOGETHER, I GUESS A QUESTION I HAVE IS WHY WASN'T ACTION TAKEN ON IT THEN? FORGIVE ME BUT I DON'T RECALL IN 2006 YOU PUT THIS PLAN TOGETHER. WHY DIDN'T WE PUT IT TO A REFERENDUM THEN? >> I THINK 82 DOLLARS -- $82 MILLION HAD A LOT TO DO WITH THAT. I THINK THE PLAN WAS TO ADOPT IT, COME BACK, AND FIGURE OUT HOW TO GET THE ACTION DONE. I THINK ABOUT THREE YEARS AGO THE PARKS AND RECREATION DEPARTMENT TRIED TO DO A $23 MILLION BOND REFERENDUM. THEY WENT TO THE COUNTY TO ASK THEM TO DO THAT. AND THAT WAS REJECTED. >> I GUESS MY FOLLOW-UP QUESTION IS WE'VE GONE TO THE PUBLIC BEFORE, WITH THESE REFERENDUMS. HAVE WE EVER BEEN SUCCESSFUL? >> NO, SIR, WE HAVEN'T. >> FROM YOUR WERE -- PERSPECTIVE, WHY HAVEN'T WE BEEN SUCCESSFUL? >> WELL, I TALK TO MY COLLEAGUES ABOUT THAT. WHEN WE GO TO DIRECTOR WORKSHOPS UP IN RALEIGH, AND YOU TALK TO PEOPLE AROUND THE COUNTRY, FROM WHAT I GATHER, THE MOST -- THE CITY OF FAYETTEVILLE OR CUMBERLAND COUNTY -- AND I WANT TO BE DELICATE ABOUT THIS NOW -- OUR MINDSET, YOU KNOW, WANTING TO BE A THRIVING COMMUNITY, HAVING THAT, THAT -- THE ABILITY FOR YOUNG PEOPLE TO LIVE A QUALITY LIFE. OUR SENIORS ARE MORE ACTIVE NOW. WE JUST HAVE A GROWING COMMUNITY NOW. EVERYWHERE I GO. AND I HEAR NEGATIVES TOO. BUT WHEN YOU SIT DOWN AND YOU TALK TO PEOPLE ABOUT ARE PARKS AND RECREATION, THEIR INTENT IS TO LIVE A BETTER LIFE. I THINK OUR COMMUNITY HAS COME TO THE POINT NOW WHERE THEY ARE GOING TO CHOOSE TO LIVE A BETTER LIFE AND THEY WANT THE AMENITIES TO LIVE THAT LIFE. SO I THINK WE ARE HERE NOW. I DON'T THINK WE WERE THERE 20 YEARS AGO OR 15 YEARS AGO. I THINK WE ARE THERE NOW. >> JUST A QUESTION, I MEANT TO ASK YOU FRIDAY AND I FORGOT TO. THE GATEWAYS, THE PARKS AND RECREATION DEPARTMENT MANAGE THAT? >> YES, SIR. >> WOULD THAT BE A PART OF THE PACKAGE AND UPGRADE WE SEE IN THE PARKS AND BOND REFERENDUM? OR IS THAT PART OF YOUR MAINTENANCE RENOVATION PIECE? >> NO. AND I DON'T KNOW IF -- I HAVE PERSONAL VIEWS ON GATEWAYS. BUT THAT'S NOT A PART OF THIS. I WOULD LOVE TO BE ABLE TO COME BACK AT ANOTHER LATER DATE AND TALK ABOUT GATEWAYS. I THINK WE CAN DO A LOT BETTER JOB WITH OUR GATEWAYS. I THINK WE CAN USE NATURAL ENTRY FEATURES TO INTRODUCE PEOPLE TO THE CITY LIMITS. BUT NO, SIR, THAT'S NOT A PART OF THIS, THIS BOND PACKAGE. >> THE LAST THING YOU STATED THAT YOU FEEL MORE CONFIDENT THIS CAN GO THROUGH NOW AS OPPOSED TO IN PREVIOUS YEARS. ONE THING, WHAT MAKES YOU FEEL MORE CONFIDENT? >> DIVERSITY. WE HAVE A TREMENDOUSLY DIVERSE COMMUNITY. WE HAVE PEOPLE WHO HAVE DIFFERENT INTERESTS. I'LL GIVIA A PRIME EXAMPLE. WHEN WE HAD THE CAPE FEAR RIVER TRAIL, WE HAD TREMENDOUS OPPOSITION. WHY WOULD YOU SPEND $5 MILLION PUTTING A ROAD THROUGH THE WOODS? AND WORKING WITH JERRY DIETZEN AND THE FORMER BOSS ROBERT BARE TO FOOT, IT WAS A STEP ON FAITH OR A LEAP OF FAITH TO SAY IF WE BUILD THIS THING, WE BELIEVE THAT THIS COMMUNITY WILL USE IT. AND TO THIS POINT NOW, THE CAPE FEAR RIVER TRAIL IS PROBABLY ONE OF THE GREATEST THINGS THAT THIS COMMUNITY HAS AS AN ASSET FOR OUR CITIZENS TO GO OUT AND GET AWAY FROM TRAFFIC TO GET AWAY FROM STOPLIGHTS AND GO OUT AND JUST WALK AND NOT BE HARASSED BY THE URBANIZATION OF OUR COMMUNITY NOW. SO THE DIVERSITY IN THIS COMMUNITY THAT WE HAVE NOW, OUR POPULATION GROWTH TELLS ME THAT THIS KIND OF PLAN NOW ONLY GETS MORE EXPENSIVE. IT DOESN'T GET ANY LESS EXPENSIVE, AND IT ONLY GROWS FOR OUR CITIZENS IF WE DON'T DO SOMETHING NOW. >> THANK YOU. >> MR. HAIRE? >> MR. GIBSON? >> YES, SIR? >> THE MORE I HEAR YOU TALK ABOUT THIS PLAN, EVEN IF I HAVE SOME THINGS, SOME CONCERNS OR SOME QUESTIONS THAT HAVE COME TO ME OVER THE WEEKEND, THE MORE I LIKE IT. I REALLY HAVE APPRECIATED THE PRESENTATION, AT LEAST THE LAST TWO. >> THANK YOU. >> AND THOSE ARE THE ONLY TWO THAT I REALLY, REALLY, REALLY HEARD. I GUESS MY EARS, MY EYES OPENED ON THOSE TWO PRESENTATIONS, SO I THANK YOU FOR THE HARD WORK AND YOU HAVE DONE AN EXCELLENT JOB. I THINK IT'S PAGE 7. I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S SLIDE 7. I COUNTED THE 35EU7B8GZ -- PAGES BUT THE ONES WITH THE CIRCLES. >> YES, SIR. >> I THINK YOU SAID THAT NOW THIS RIGHT HERE IS FAYETTEVILLE? >> THAT'S OUR CITY LIMITS. >> THAT'S ALL FAYETTEVILLE HERE? >> YES, SIR. >> AND IF I UNDERSTOOD YOUR QUESTION, IF I UNDERSTOOD YOUR PRESENTATION, THAT EVERYONE IN FAYETTEVILLE WHEREVER THESE CIRCLES ARE WHERE WE ARE GOING TO DO SOMETHING MAJOR, THEY WOULD HAVE A MILD 1.5, A MILE AND A HALF TRAVEL? >> NO, IF YOU GO BACK TO THE NEXT SLIDE, THAT SLIDE IS OF THE AQUATICS FACILITIES. THE NEIGHBORHOOD POOLS. >> MM-HMM. >> THAT'S, THAT'S WHERE EVERYBODY WILL HAVE -- WILL BE NO MORE THAN 1.5 MILES AWAY FROM AN AQUATICS CENTER WITHIN THE CITY. >> ANYWHERE WITHIN THE CITY. >> YES, SIR. >> WITHIN THAT TYPE OF FACILITY, THERE WILL BE -- >> WELL, THAT'S JUST OUR POOLS -- WELL, AND THE DESIGN OF THOSE POOLS ARE FOR KIDS FROM BASICALLY IF YOU CAN WALK BECAUSE THEY CALL THEM ZERO ENTRIES. WE WILL DESIGN THOSE AQUATIC CENTERS SIMILAR TO SEABROOK BUT JUST A LITTLE BIT BIGGER BECAUSE IN THOSE AREAS THAT WE'RE GOING TO GO INTO IN THE WESTERN AND THE ESPECIALLY NOW, IN THE NORTHERN PART OF FAYETTEVILLE, THAT THOSE AQUATICS -- NEIGHBORHOOD AQUATICS FACILITIES WILL BE A LOT LARGER. THAT'S WHY WE HAVE MONEY TO RENOVATE SEABROOK'S AREA TO MAKE IT LARGER BASED ON POPULATION GROWTH. BUT THAT ONLY THING THAT REASON I PUT THAT SLIDE BACK IN WAS TO SHOW THE COMMUNITY THAT WE'RE GEOGRAPHICALLY, WE'RE LOOKING AT THE COMMUNITY WITH POPULATION GROWTH AND HOW WE PLACE THE DIFFERENT NEIGHBORHOOD PARKS, NEIGHBORHOOD POOLS, SO THAT PEOPLE CAN GET TO THEM. THAT THEY HAVE ACCESS. >> OKAY. OKAY. OKAY. NOW, THE, THEN THE ONE THAT I'M LOOKING AT JUST BEFORE THAT, EXPLAIN THAT ONE TO ME. THOSE CIRCLES. >> WELL, ALL THAT SHOWS IS OUR TOTAL PROJECT LIST. AND WHERE WE THINK THOSE PROJECTS SHOULD GO THROUGHOUT THE COMMUNITY. AND IF YOU LOOK AT THE SPORTS COMPLEX, THE CITY HAS ALREADY BOUGHT 50 ACRES OUT ON FIELDS ROAD ON EXIT 49. TO PUT THAT SPORTS COMPLEX THE CAPE FEAR RIVER PARK, THE CITY HAS PURCHASED 13 ACRES DOWN ON THE RIVER. YOU GO UP TO THE MULTIPURPOSE AQUATICS CENTER, THE CITY ALREADY OWNS 16 ACRES IN BRAGG BOULEVARD THE MAJOR THUR THOROUGHFARE. WE ALREADY OWN THAT. IF YOU LOOK AT THE POOLS AND NEIGHBORHOOD PARKS, THE GREEN SQUARES AND THEN THE LITTLE RED DOTS ARE THE RENOVATION PLANS TO EXISTING FACILITIES SO WE JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT PEOPLE SAW HOW ENCOMPASSING THIS PLAN IS OR THESE PROJECTS ARE THAT WE TOUCH EVERY ZIP CODE AND THAT'S MAINLY HOW WE SORT OF WORK BECAUSE WHEN YOU GO THROUGH THE ZIP CODES, THEN YOU KNOW YOU'RE TOUCHING EVERYBODY WHO LIVES IN THE COMMUNITY. AND IN EVERY ZIP CODE BASED ON THE MASTER PLAN, WE HAVE PROJECTS GOING ON, UPGRADES AND RENOVATIONS. >> AND THAT DEPENDED ON -- WHEN YOU SAY THE ZIP CODES, THAT DEPENDED -- YOU LOOKED AT THAT IN PLANNING BY THE GROWTH WITHIN THOSE ZIP CODES. >> 0, NO DOUBT ABOUT IT. I MEAN, AND I WANT TO GO BACK TO THIS NOW. THE ECONOMIC IMPACT OR THE ABILITY FOR THE FACILITY TO, TO GENERATE REVENUE WAS A MAJOR PART OF WHAT WE DID. YOU DIDN'T WANT TO GO OUT AND JUST DEAL SOMETHING AND THEN COME BACK TO THE COUNCIL OR GO TO KRISTOFF AND SAY LOOK HERE. WE NEED MORE MONEY. WE WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT WE PUT THESE POOLS OR THESE PARKS OR THESE MAJOR FACILITIES IN PLACES WHERE WE COULD -- THAT THE PEOPLE WERE. YOU DON'T WANT TO PUT IT SOMEPLACE WHERE KIDS CAN'T GET TO IT OR PARENTS CAN'T GET TO, AND IN YOUR FIRST BOOK WE GAVE YOU, WE GAVE YOU THAT BREAKDOWN SO THAT YOU COULD SEE IN THE 28306 AND 28304 COMMUNITY THERE WERE 73,000 FAMILIES LIVING IN THAT AREA, AND THAT'S ONE OF THE PLACES WHERE WE WERE GOING TO PUT A POOL. WELL, BASICALLY IN THAT AREA, THERE WAS -- I THINK 73% OF THAT, OF THOSE THOSE HOMEOWNERS OR FAMILIES HAD KIDS. AND THAT'S BORN OUT BY OUR SCHOOL POPULATION AND THE AMOUNT OF SCHOOLS THAT THEY ARE BUILDING IN THAT AREA. BUT WE LOOKED AT THAT COMPLETELY. WE WANTED TO MIKE -- MAKE SURE WE WEREN'T PUTTING OASISES OUT THERE WHERE NOBODY WOULD GO TO THEM. >> MY LAST COMMENT. I KEEP IN CONTACT WITH MY COMMUNITIES A LOT. I HAVE HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS OF E-MAILS, AND I SEND IT OUT AND I ASK THEM TO GIVE ME THEIR INPUT BACK ON WHAT THEY THOUGHT ABOUT THIS. I EVEN SENT THEM TO THE WEB SITE AND YOU KNOW, HOW WHERE TO CLICK AT AND WHATNOT. AND OUT OF ALL THAT CAME BACK, THE MAJORITY OF IT WAS SUPPORT FOR WITH REGARDS ON WHAT GOES ON TONIGHT. THEY SUPPORTED WHAT THEY SAW COMING TOWARD THE COMMUNITY. SO AGAIN, THANK YOU. >> I THANK YOU. >> YES, SIR. >> MS. APPLEWHITE? >> THANK YOU, MAYOR. I THINK MY QUESTION MAY BE FOR LISA SMITH. I'M I'M NOT SURE SO STAND BY. MY ISSUE IS MORE PRIORITY FOR OUR CITY, AND MY NUMBER ONE PRIORITY IS THE ISSUE OF CRIME. I THINK EVERYONE ON THIS COUNCIL MADE CRIME A PRIORITY, AT LEAST ADDRESSING CRIME WHEN WE CAMPAIGNED AND I'M CERTAIN THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS WE HEAR FROM OUR CITIZENS. I HAD AN AMAZING QUESTION FROM ONE OF MY CITIZENS WHO SAID MS. APPLEWHITE, I'D BE WILLING TO PAY A TAX, A PENNY OR TWO IF YOU -- IF IT WERE A PUBLIC SAFETY TAX. AND ASK THE QUESTION AS TO WHETHER OR NOT OUR EFFORTS HERE COULD BE A BUNDLED EFFORT, A PUBLIC SAFETY/PARKS AND REC SO WE ARE NOT JUST TALKING ABOUT POOLS WE ARE TALKING ABOUT POLICE. SO I'M WONDERING IF WE HAD THE ABILITY IF THIS WERE TO PAUSE FOR A SECOND, LISA, IS IT POSSIBLE TO HAVE A BOND ON THE BALLOT THAT NOT JUST ADDRESSED PARKS AND REC BUT PERHAPS HAD A SMALL ENTITY. HOW MUCH ARE WE SPENDING ON THIS PER $100? >> 2.25 CENTS. >> SO IF WE COULD HAVE A HALF A CENT OR SOMETHING LIKE THIS ATTACHED TO THE PACKAGE AND PUT THAT ON THE BALLOT, IS THAT POSSIBLE TO MIX USES OR IS THIS ONE FOR KAREN? MS. McDONALD. >> I SAY THAT IT'S A MIX OF LEGAL STAFF AND BOND COUNCIL AND OUR FINANCE STAFF. I AM NOT SURE I KNOW ALL OF IT. THE CHALLENGE HERE IS THAT YOU DON'T NEED VOTER APPROVAL TO RAISE YOUR TAX RATE. YOU HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO DO THAT WITHOUT VOTER APPROVAL. THE REASON WHY THIS HAS TO GO TO THE PUBLIC IS BECAUSE WE ARE AUTHORIZING GEODEBT. AND IT IS THAT QUESTION THAT IS GOING TO THE PUBLIC, TRULY. THEY'RE ANSWERING THAT QUESTION. THE QUESTION OF WHAT WE DO AS FAR AS TAX TO PAY THAT BACK IS INFORMATION THAT GOES ALONG WITH THAT QUESTION. OKAY? >> SO BUT MY QUESTION IS JUST REALLY SIMPLE. CAN BOTH BE ON THE -- I KNOW THERE IS A LONG ANSWER. I WANT THE BOND FOR DUMMIES. >> YOU CAN PUT ANYTHING YOU WANT AS FAR AS INFORMATION, BUT WHAT THEY ARE APPROVING IS THE BOND ISSUANCE. THEY ARE NOT APPROVING THE TAX RATE. >> SO FOR EXAMPLE THIS IS THE DISCUSSION. ABOUT A MONTH AGO, LONGER THAN A MONTH AGO, WE DID -- WE HAD BEEN DISCUSSING POLICE SUBSTATION FOR QUITE SOMETIME, AND I READ OVER THE PACKAGE, AND I THINK THERE WAS SOME PROJECTIONS IN TERMS OF COSTS. $3 MILLION, $5 MILLION, AND $7 MILLION. VERY PRELIMINARY. BUT, YOU KNOW, ONE IN WE USE EXISTING BUILDING. OR DO A LEASE OPTION ON THE OTHER END. WE FIND PROPERTY AND BUILD IT. YOU HAD 3, 5, $7 MILLION PLAY IN THERE. SO MY QUESTION IS IN WESTERN FAYETTEVILLE AND UNLIKE COUNCILMEMBER HAIRE, I DID NOT GET ONE PHONE CALL SUPPORTIVE OF THIS. THEY WERE MORE INTERESTED IN SAFETY, SECURITY, AND FILLING OUR POLICE ALLOCATIONS. I KNOW WE ARE HIRING EIGHT OR SO WHATEVER THE NUMBER IS THIS YEAR. BUT THEY WANT THAT WHOLE 27 SO JUST VERY INTELLIGENT QUESTION COULD WE PUT IT ON THE SAME VOTE THAT APPEARS TO BE YES BECAUSE YOU SAID WE CAN PUT ANYTHING ON THERE. >> AS FAR AS -- WHAT YOU WANTED TO DO WITH THE TAX RATE, YOU CAN PUT THAT ON THERE. IF YOU WANTED TO INCUR AUTHORIZE MORE DEBT, I MEAN YOU HAVE TALKED JUST THERE. >> TAKE SOME OF THIS OFF AND REPLACE IT WITH A POLICE SUBSTATION SO IF WE DID DO $56 MILLION, WE DID $45 AND PUT A SUBSTATION, COULD WE MIX THAT UP IF WE WANTED TO? >> I ASSUME YOU COULD. >> OKAY. NOW, THE NEXT QUESTION I HAVE IS I BELIEVE THAT THERE ARE THREE BOND -- I AM NOT SMART ON THIS. THREE BONDS THAT WILL BE APPROVED IN THIS, CORRECT? >> THREE ISSUANCES. >> THREE ISSUANCES. >> IS THERE A WAY BECAUSE IT FEELS LIKE THIS IS AN ALL OR NOTHING SITUATION. IS THERE A WAY ON THE BALLOT TO HAVE LISTED THREE SEPARATE BONDS, BOND A IS GOING TO GET THIS 30, $26 MILLION FACILITY, CHECK YES OR NO. BOND B, THE SECOND IS GOING TO BE FOR THE NEIGHBORHOOD POOLS. IF YOU'RE INTERESTED IN JUST THAT PORTION, CHECK B OR C WOULD BE, YOU KNOW, ALL THE OTHERS. SO I'M WONDERING ON THAT BOND ON THE BALLOT, COULD WE HAVE THREE BOND PROPOSALS INSTEAD OF BUNDLING IT ALL BECAUSE SOME SITVENS SIT -- CITIZENS ARE INTERESTED IN SOME OF THE PACKAGE AND NOT ALL OF IT. O SO MAYBE WE CAN DO À LA CARTE. IS THAT POSSIBLE OR DOES IT HAVE TO BE ONE GREAT BIG QUESTION? >> WE HAVEN'T ASKED THE BOND COUNCIL THAT SPECIFIC QUESTION. WE CERTAINLY NEED TO GET MORE INFORMATION. I NEED TO -- PART OF THE CHALLENGES WOULD BE, HOWEVER, THAT WE NEED TO DO IS ACTUALLY -- THE REASON THEY ARE SPACED OUT IS THAT WE NEED TO SPEND MONEY TO ACTUALLY DESIGN THEM. AS PART OF THE PROCESS. >> WITH THAT BEING SAID, I AM JUST ASKING THE 101 QUESTION SO MY CITIZENS CAN UNDERSTAND IT AND I CAN UNDERSTAND IT. IF THERE ARE THREE BONDS, NO MATTER WHEN THEY ARE FUNDED OR WHATEVER THE FINANCIAL TERMS ARE, CAN THERE BE THREE SEPARATE LISTINGS ON -- BECAUSE WE ARE GOING TO PAY $100,000 TO DO THIS ELECTION. I CAN GUESS WE CAN PUT WHATEVER QUESTIONS WE WANT ON THERE. I WOULD GUESS. >> I WOULD GUESS BUT THERE WOULD HAVE TO BE THREE SEPARATE QUESTIONS. EACH ONE WOULD HAVE TO PASS SEPARATELY. >> YES, SIR, THAT'S WHAT I AM ASKING. IS THAT GOING TO COST US ANYMORE IN $100,000 THAT WE ARE ALREADY GOING TO PAY? >> THAT I DON'T KNOW. >> SO PROBABLY JUST AN EXTRA QUESTION, CORRECT? NO MORE? NO MORE COST? >> I DON'T KNOW. >> YOU DON'T KNOW. WHO WOULD KNOW? >> WE WOULD HAVE TO ASK THE DEPARTMENT OF ELECTIONS. >> SO YOU THINK THEY WOULD CHARGE US MORE MONEY JUST FOR PUTTING AN EXTRA QUESTION ON THERE? >> I DON'T KNOW, MA'AM. I HAVEN'T ASKED THEM. >> OKAY. WELL, THANK YOU. >> MR. CRISP? >> I'M SORRY, I GOT A LIGHT. >> COUNCILMEMBER APPLEWHITE, I DID WANT TO CLARIFY ONE OF THE QUESTIONS THAT YOU ASKED AS IT RELATED TO THE HIRING OF THE POLICE OFFICERS. WE WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO ISSUE BOND DEBT FOR THE HIRING, I.E., OF THE OFFICERS IN THE OPERATION -- >> BUT COULD WE BUILD 3 OR 5 OR $7 MILLION FACILITY. >> YES BUT I WANTED TO CLARIFY IT WOULD ONLY BE FOR THE CAPITAL OUTLAY. >> ONE-TIME SORT OF COST TO BUILD IT VERSUS A RECURRING COST FOR THE POLICE OFFICERS? SO THAT IS POSSIBLE? >> I HAVE BEEN STOPPED IN THE FOOD LION, THE PARKING LOT, EVERYWHERE. I HAVE A SITUATION THAT'S VERY DIFFERENT FROM COUNCILMEMBER HAIRE AS MRS. APPLEWHITE HAS STATED. TODAY IS THE FIRST DAY IN ALL THIS TIME THAT I HAVE EVER RECEIVED AN E-MAIL ENDORSING THIS. AND THE GENTLEMAN THAT CEPT ME THE E-MAIL -- SENT ME THE E-MAIL IS PRESENT HERE TONIGHT. THAT'S THE FIRST TIME. I AM DEALING WITH A A BUNCH OF ANGRY CITIZENS THAT ARE STILL ANGRY ABOUT TAXATION VIA ANNEXATION. WHAT I WANT, MR. MAYOR, YOU OR WHOEVER, I GOT THREE MEETINGS THIS SATURDAY. I NEED SOMEBODY -- THE LAST TWO OF THESE PRESENTATIONS HAVE BEEN ABSOLUTELY EXCELLENT, BUT WHAT I HAVE, AND I HAD PEOPLE TALKING TO ME SUNDAY AS I CAME OUT OF THE CHURCH, I HAVE A BUNCH OF CITIZENS THAT DON'T UNDERSTAND THIS AT ALL. THE ONLY THING THEY UNDERSTAND. TAXATION IS GOING TO INCREASE MY TAXES. I LIKE THIS. BUT I NEED SOMEBODY TO COME OUT AND SELL IT TO THEM, AND I DON'T WANT TO PUSH THIS DOWN THE THROATS OF THEM RIGHT NOW. THIS THING IS TOO IMPORTANT TO FAIL BUT I DON'T SHARE YOUR OPTIMISM THAT IF WE GO AT IT IMMEDIATELY TONIGHT THAT IT'S GOING TO PASS. I DON'T SHARE THAT AT ALL BECAUSE I DON'T HAVE PEOPLE IN MY DISTRICT OTHERS DON'T THAT ARE IN FAVOR OF THIS AS IT IS. BUT I THINK THE PROBLEM IS WE WE HAVEN'T EDUCATED THEM AND I WOULD HOPE THAT WE CAN DELAY AT LEAST A MONTH AND GIVE US AN OPPORTUNITY TO BETTER EDUCATE OUR CITIZENS. THANK YOU. >> MR. FOWLER. >> YES, SIR, CAN WE GO BACK TO THE CIRCLES ON THE AQUATIC CENTER? >> MR. GIBSON, YOU HAD STATED IT WAS A 6-MILE RADIUS ON THE CIRCLES. >> YES, SIR. >> A 12-MILE DIAMETER. >> NO, SIR. THE RADIUS IS FROM POINT TO POINT. IT'S 6-MILES, IT'S THREE MILES ACROSS. >> THE CIRCLE'S A THREE-MILE CIRCLE, SO 1 AND A HALF MILE RADIUS ON EACH CIRCLE. >> THAT WAS THE CLARIFICATION I NEEDED. I AM TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW YOU COULD ONLY BE A MILE AND A HALF. >> CAN WE FLIP TO THE CIRCLE WITH THE ONES WITH THE CIRCLES ON THE PARKS. I AMHEARING THE SAME THING ON MY END OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD AS WELL. MAYOR PRO TEM ARP AND I ROAD WITH YOU ON FRIDAY AND I AM NOT GOING TO BE AS DELICATE ABOUT CHANGES IN PEOPLE'S PERCEPTION BUT WITH THESE SMALLER NEIGHBORHOOD PARKS THAT'S A LOT MORE MAINTENANCE THAT'S GOING TO BE REQUIRED THAN WE CURRENTLY HAVE, I WOULD THINK, AND THE THING I AM NOT GOING TO BE NOT DELICATE ABOUT IS NOT WHAT PARKS AND RECS ARE DOING BUT WHAT CITIZENS ARE DOING WITH OUR PARKZ. I BELIEVE THAT WHEN WHEN YOUR STAFF IS HAVING TO CLEAN UP THE PARK, THAT CLEAN UP SHOULD BE TAKING BAGS OF TRASH OUT OF THE TRASH CANS AND REPLACING THEM WITH EMPTY BAGS BUT WHAT I SAW WAS TRASH STREWN ALL OVER THE PARK. I MEAN, JUST CUPS, PAPERS, WRAPPERS, STUFF THROWN ALL OVER THE PARK. WHICH ISN'T AN ADDITIONAL MAINTENANCE EXPENSE I AM SURE FOR YOU BECAUSE OF TIME, OF PEOPLE HAVING TO GO OUT AND CLEAN IT UP AND TO BE FAIR TO YOU AND YOUR STAFF, YOU CAN'T BE OUT THERE EVERY 15 MINUTES, YOU KNOW, CLEANING UP TRASH BUT IT'S ONE OF THE THOSE THINGS THAT GIVES AN APPEARANCE OF A LACK OF CARE. AGAIN LIKE I SAID, THAT'S NOT YOU THAT HAS THE LACK OF CARE. IT'S THE PEOPLE USING THE PARK. AND WHEN WE START TO HAVE MORE OPPORTUNITIES AROUND PARTICULARLY THE SMALLER NEIGHBORHOOD PARKS, HAS THAT BEEN CONSIDERED HOW THAT MAINTENANCE IS GOING TO WORK THAT'S TRANSPORTING A LOT MORE LAWN MOWERS AROUND AND STUFF TO MOW OR ARE YOU PLANNING TO FARM OUT SOME OF THAT AND HOW IS SOME OF THAT GOING TO WORK? >> WELL, ONE OF THE THINGS WE ARE DOING AND WE HAVE BEEN DOING FOR OVER THE PAST 3 YEARS IS WE ARE CHANGING THE RESPONSIBILITY OF OUR ON SITE STAFF AT OUR RECREATION FACILITIES. IN THE PAST, IF YOU SAW A PERSON CLEANING UP THE REC CENTER, THAT PERSON DIDN'T HAVE ANY RESPONSIBILITY TO THE OUTSIDE OF THE FACILITY. >> MM-HMM. >> OVER THE PAST TWO AND A HALF, MAYBE THREE YEARS, WE HAVE REQUESTED THAT WE CHANGE THAT PERSON'S RESPONSIBILITY FROM A CUSTODIAN TO A MAINTENANCE WORKER, WHICH WOULD GIVE THAT PERSON MORE RESPONSIBILITY TO GO OUTSIDE OF THAT FACILITY AND CLEAN IT UP. >> SO THEY WOULD STILL CLEAN INSIDE BUT ALSO CLEAN OUTSIDE. >> I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE WE ARE NOT ABANDONING ONE FOR THE OTHER. >> NO, SIR. AND WHAT YOU ARE HAVING IS WHEN THE CENTER STAFF OR THE PERSON WHO WORKS AT A RECREATIONAL CENTER CAN DO MORE OF, THEN WHAT THAT DOES NOW IS EXTENDS OUR PARK STAFF TO HAVE MORE MAN HOURS TO GO TO THE UNMANNED PARKS, THESE NEIGHBORHOOD PARKS, AND DO MORE WORK THERE. NOW I WANT TO BE REAL CLEAR. AT ANY TIME THAT YOU GO TO ONE OF OUR NEIGHBORHOOD PARKS, YOU COULD EASILY SEE TRASH. >> 0, I OH, I KNOW. >> THAT'S BASED ON A USAGE ISSUE. I LIVE OUT IN THE WESTERN PART OF THE COMMUNITY. I LIVE OFF OF FISHER ROAD. >> MM-HMM. >> AND WHENEVER I GO TO PARKS, AND ONE OF THE THINGS -- I DON'T KNOW HOW LONG I HAVE MY ANONYMITY NOW BUT I GO OUT TO THE PARK AND PEOPLE DON'T KNOW WHO I AM. AND YOU GET AN HONEST OPINION OF HOW PEOPLE USE YOUR FACILITY. AND ONE OF THE THINGS I HEAR THE MOST IS WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH. IF YOU GO DOWN FISHER ROAD OVER AT HONEYCUTT, IT IS -- WE GOT KIDS PRACTICING ON THE SIDE OF THE ROAD IN THAT PARK. WHEN WE WENT ON OUR RIDE THE OTHER DAY, IT WAS 7:30 IN THE MORNING. WHEN STAFF WAS THERE, CHANGES WERE BEING MADE, TRASH BAGS SHOULD'VE BEEN CHANGED OUT. WHEN WE LEFT, THERE WERE 25, 30 PEOPLE COMING INTO THE PARK. AS SOON AS THEY GO OUT AND COME BACK, THERE IS GOING TO BE MORE TRASH THERE JUST BECAUSE URBANIZATION IS GROWING SO FAST. BUT WE ARE MAKING PLANS. WE ARE DOING THINGS TO CHANGE THAT. >> MY CONCERN IS NOT THE TRASH IN THE CANS. IT'S THE TRASH OUTSIDE THE CANS, WHICH YOU HAVE NO CONTROL OVER. >> I AGREE. LITTER IN THE COMMUNITY. >> AND I WANT TO GO TO ANOTHER LAST QUESTION WHICH HAS TO DO WITH THE OPERATIONAL COSTS BECAUSE I THINK THAT'S THE ISSUE THAT YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT SUSTAINING -- THERE WOULD BE SUSTAINING BECAUSE THE OPERATIONAL COSTS WOULD BE OFFSET. I WANT YOU TO UNDERSTAND THAT TO OFFSET THE OPERATIONAL COSTS THERE WILL BE A FEE TO USE THE CITY WHETHER YOU ARE A CITY TAXPAYER OR NOT. SOME OF THE FACILITIES ARE GOING TO REQUIRE USER FEES ON TOP OF THE FACT THAT WE'RE FLOATING THE BOND TO PAY FOR THEM, IS THAT CORRECT OR NOT CORRECT? >> YES, SIR, IT IS. >> AND PEOPLE FRAUGHT -- FROM OUTSIDE THE COMMUNITY COULD USE THE FACILITY,S, THEY WOULD PAY A FEE BUT IT WOULD BE A HIGHER FEE. HAVE YOU FACTORED IN A COST FOR IDENTIFICATION FACTOR SO CITIZENS OF FAYETTEVILLE CAN BE EASILY IDENTIFIED AS CITIZENS SO THAT FACILITY FEES CAN BE COLLECTED? >> WE ALREADY HAVE THE PROCESS. WHEN KIDS SIGN UP FOR FOOTBALL, BASKETBALL, BASEBALL, WE HAVE AN IDENTIFICATION WHERE YOU SIT IN FRONT OF A CAMERA AND TAKE A PICTURE OF THE CHILD OR A PERSON IN A PROGRAM. THEIR ADDRESS, WHERE THEY LIVE. THEY HAVE TO BRING IN THREE IDENTIFICATIONS. ONLY THING THAT WE WOULD DO IS WE WOULD EXTEND THAT AND SORT OF USE WHAT THE LIBRARY DOES WE WOULD GIVE THEM A CARD, AN I.D. CARD WITH THEIR NAME ON THE BACK WITH INFORMATION THAT THEY COULD JUST SWIPE. >> OKAY. WOULD IT BE A PHOTO I.D.? >> 0, YES, YES, SIR. WE WOULD BE ABLE TO IDENTIFY THEM. >> I HAVE SHARED AN EXPERIENCE WITH MR. HAIRE BECAUSE WE ARE ON THE WEST SIDE OF FAYETTEVILLE. BUT NOTWITHSTANDING. BUT IF YOU LOOK AT THE ALL-AMERICAN HIGHWAY, WHICH I WILL SAY ON THIS MAP IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S PRETTY MUCH RIGHT DOWN THE MIDDLE OF FAYETTEVILLE. ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE MAP YOU HAVE FIVE MAJOR PROJECTS. TO THE EAST. ON THE WEST SIDE OF THE MAP YOU HAVE FOUR MAJOR PROJECTS. THEY HAVE BEEN IDENTIFIED. NOW, I WOULD HOPE THAT ALL OF OUR CITIZENS WITHOUT REGARD TO WHAT SIDE OF THE CITY THEY LIVE ON UNDERSTAND THAT THE FUTURE IS STILL GOING TO BE THE FUTURE FOR EVERYBODY HERE. AND THAT WE TAKE THE TIME, LOOK AT, STUDY, AND CONTEMPLATE AND MAKE A WISE VOTE IN TERMS OF THE FUTURE OF THIS CITY, DHERVE -- WHICHEVER WAY IT HAPPENS TO GO BUT NOTWITHSTANDING ALL OF THAT, I WANT TO THANK THE COMMITTEE FOR HAVING SHOWN A DEGREE OF BALANCE, OF THIS, IF THIS DOESN'T FLY, IT'S BECAUSE THE BIRD DOESN'T HAVE ANY WINGS. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >> MR. BATES? >> WELL, I'M LIKE THE REST OF THEM. THE ONLY ONES I HAVE HEARD IN FAVOR WERE FROM THE FAYETTEVILLE PARKS AND REC BOARD OR THE SENIOR ADVISEE BOARD WERE THE ONLY ONES I HEARD OF THAT WERE IN FAVOR. I HAVE HEARD THAT, YOU KNOW, THE CRIME, THE CRIME, THE CRIME IS ALL IN THE NEIGHBORHOODS, IT'S EVERYWHERE. AND UNTIL WE DO SOMETHING TO GET, AND I KNOW, THE CRIME, IF YOU BUILD IT, THEY WILL COME. AND YOU ARE CORRECT. BECAUSE I WON'T SAY THE NAME OF THE STORE ON SKIBO, I WON'T SAY WHERE, BECAUSE OF THE CRIME. WHERE DID THEY MOVE, ACROSS THE STREET. WHAT DID THEY JUST DO INTHEY JUST SHUT DOWN FOR PRETTY MUCH PUTTING A CURFEW ON THEMSELVES THERE. SO THEN THEY ARE GOING TO FIND SOMEWHERE ELSE TO GO, AND THAT IS MY CONCERN. IS THE CRIME. AND THEN THE AQUATIC SENIOR CENTER. YOU KNOW, I HAVE MENTIONED IT BEFORE. II AM NOT COMFORTABLE WITH, YOU KNOW, BRAGG BOULEVARD FOR ONE, INGRESS AND EGRESS, YOU KNOW, THE ROAD WOULD HAVE TO BE CHANGED. ARE THEY GOING TO LET US CLEAR CUT 16 ACRES? THAT CLOSE TO THE WATERSHED? TO PUT IT IN AND THEN THE PARKING LOT, YOU KNOW YOU HAVE ALL YOUR OIL AND STUFF RUN OFF. I AM GOING TO SAY -- I AM WITH MR. CRISP. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE IT GIVE US 30 MORE DAYS TO SPECIAL MAINTENANCE THAT THIS IS THE ONLY THING ON THE AGENDA. AND LET'S BUMP SOME HEADS AND KNUCKLES AND ALL THAT GOOD STUFF AND TWEAK IT A LITTLE BIT MORE. SO BUT THAT'S MY CONCERN IS THE CRIME AND LOCATIONS OF A COUPLE OF THEM. >> MR. HURST? I'M SORRY, MR. BATES, IS THAT EVERYTHING? MR. HURST? >> THANK YOU, MR. MAYOR. THANK YOU FOR THE FAYETTEVILLE CUMBERLAND COUNTY PARKS ADVISORY COMMITTEE FOR THEIR MANY YEARS OF HARD WORK. AND MR. GIBSON FOR YOUR LEADERSHIP. I WAS LOOKING OVER THIS MAP. I HAVE HAD A MIX OF CITIZENS, SOME SUPPORT, SOME DO NOT, AND I THINK THE EDUCATION PROCESS IS CRITICAL AS WE MOVE FORWARD WITH THIS. I THINK IT'S CRITICAL WE GIVE THE CITIZENS THE OPPORTUNITY TO VOTE. IN DISTRICT 5, THE ONLY IMPROVEMENTS THAT I HAVE SEEN WAS TWO YEARS AGO TO WOOD ROW STREET, WILSON STREET PARK, WHICH HELPED AS I'VE SEEN ELIMINATE SOME OF THE TRAFFIC AND HEAVY -- LARGE PARTICIPATION AT THE PARK AT HONEYCUTT. SO I THINK THAT'S BEEN A TREMENDOUS SUCCESS. THE ONLY NEW THING THAT WE'RE GETTING IN DISTRICT 5 IS THE TENNIS CENTER. BUT A LOT OF THE CITIZENS THAT ARE IN MY DISTRICT AROUND VILLAGE DRIVE AND THAT AREA MISS THE DARK BRANCH TENNIS COMPLEX. WHICH WAS RATHER LARGE. BECAUSE OF ITS CLOSING. SO THEY ARE VERY HAPPY TO SEE THAT IN DISTRICT 5. SO I SUPPORT IT BECAUSE OF THE FACT THAT IT'S WELL BALANCED. IT MEETS THE NEEDS OF OUR YOUNG CHILDREN AND OUR SENIORS AND THE GEOGRAPHIC LAYOUT OF THIS AND ESPECIALLY FOR THE VALUE THAT IT BRINGS TO QUALITY OF LIFE. SO I JUST COMMEND YOU ON, ON BRINGING THIS FORWARD TO THE CITY OF FAYETTEVILLE. AND I HOPE WE CAN MOVE FORWARD TO GIVE IT TO THE CITY'S CITIZENS TO VOTE. >> YES, SIR? >> MR. HAIRE? >> MR. GIBSON, ONE THING THAT I DID BRING UP THAT -- AT WHEN WE DID THE WORK SESSION, WAS A CONCERN THAT I HAD WHICH IS A LEGITIMATE CONCERN THAT I HEARD FROM MS. APPLEWHITE TONIGHT WAS CONCERNING CRIME. AND ESPECIALLY SINCE WE ARE TALKING ABOUT OUR PARKS CRIME WITHIN OUR PARK, I THINK I DON'T KNOW EXACTLY HOW I WORDED IT. I THINK THE LAST TIME I SPOKE WITH YOU, WELL YOU KNOW WE HAVE BEEN HAVING CRIME IN SOME OF OUR PARKS AND IT'S BEEN, YOU KNOW, RATHER SEVERE. WITH THE PARKS NOW AND ALL THAT'S PROPOSED IN THE PROPOSAL, WHAT'S GOING TO BE IN PLACE TO SORT OF CURTAIL, YOU KNOW, CRIME? I MEAN, YOU KNOW, WE CAN'T -- I MEAN, ARE OUR PARKS ARE THEY GOING TO BE GATES TO STOP PEOPLE WHEN THE PARKS ARE CLOSED, THERE ARE SOME PARKS THAT YOU CAN STILL DRIVE INTO. >> YES. >> AND PEOPLE ARE GOING, SO YOU KNOW, ANYTHING CAN HAPPEN. WHEN WE LOOK AT IT FROM THAT PERSPECTIVE S THAT TOO FAR OUT OF THE PICTURE, IS THAT SOMETHING FOR US TO CONSIDER. IS THAT A WORTHWHILE QUESTION? >> I THINK SO. ANYTIME YOU ARE DESIGNING SOMETHING, SAFETY IS ALWAYS A MAJOR THING. WE JUST FINISHED DOING SOMETHING OUT -- DOING RENOVATIONS HERE IN THE CITY, AND WE TALKED ABOUT THE SPORTS COMPLEX ON CENTURY CIRCLE, AND THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS WE ARE LOOKING INTO NOW IS HOW DO WE STOP PEOPLE FROM USING THE FACILITIES WHEN THEY ARE NOT IN USE. SO FENCING, CAMERAS, THAT KIND OF THING GETS US BECAUSE ONE OF THE THINGS WE LEARNED FROM OUR POLICE DEPARTMENT IS WHEN YOU HAVE A WELL LIT COMMUNITY OR WELL LIT PARK, CRIME TENDS TO STAY AWAY FROM THAT. SO ANY TIME WE ARE GOING TO DESIGN SOMETHING, SAFETY AND HOW WE MANAGE IT AND HOW IT MANAGES ITSELF WHEN PEOPLE ARE NOT THERE, IS A DEFINITE CONCERN. >> IS THAT SOMETHING IN HERE? >> IT WOULD BE IN OUR PLANNING DESIGN. >> IT WOULDN'T BE IN THE DOCUMENT WE GOT TONIGHT. >> IT WOULD BE -- I THINK IT'S THE THIRD PAGE, WHERE IT SAYS PLANNING AND DESIGN AT THE BOTTOM. >> OKAY. AND YOU SAY THAT WILL CONSIST OF -- >> ON THE FACILITY ITSELF, AND HOW WE KEEP IT SAFE. AND HOW WE MANAGE IT. AND HOW IT MANAGES ITSELF WHEN PEOPLE ARE NOT THERE. SO YEAH. >> WILL WE HAVE SOMETHING -- I CAN'T REMEMBER WHERE IT WAS. I HAD HEARD WE HAD SOME ISSUES THAT HAPPENED IN THE CITY. BUT RECORDINGS THAT COULD BE SHARED WITH OUR POLICE DEPARTMENT IF SOMETHING IS CAUGHT -- >> WE DO NAT NOW. WE HAVE CAMERAS AT OUR REC CENTERS THAT DO SORT OF LIKE A 72-HOUR LOOP. AND WE HAVE USED IT SUCCESSFULLY TO MANAGE SOME PRETTY TOUCHY SITUATIONS ALREADY. >> INTERIOR AND EXTERIOR. >> INTERIOR AND EXTERIOR. WE DO THAT NOW. >> ALL RIGHT, THANK YOU, SIR. THANK YOU. >> MR. ARP. >> THANK YOU, MR. MAYOR. MICHAEL, WE'RE TALKING -- WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE ABILITY TO MAKE SOME MAJOR IMPLICATIONS IN PARKS AND RECs AND PART OF THIS IS GOING TO BE FEE-BASED SERVICES FOR OUR CUSTOMER, AND A QUESTION I HAVE IS CURRENTLY WITH ANY PARKS OR POOLS THAT WE HAVE, ARE WE CHARGING FEES, ARE WE GENERATING REVENUE WITH EXISTING FACILITIES WE HAVE? >> YES, SIR, WE CHARGE AT THE ONE POOL THAT WE DO HAVE AT SEABROOK, WE CHARGED A FEE FOR THEM TO GET INTO IT. A DOLLAR AND $2. >> AND FROM AN OPERATING COST STANDPOINT, HOW MUCH DOES THAT GENERATE? 10%? >> WELL, I DON'T KNOW THE NUMBER RIGHT OFFHAND. BUT IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT REVENUE NEUTRAL OR GENERATES A PROFIT. AND ONE OF THE REASONS THAT I WOULD SAY WE CANNOT DO IT IS BECAUSE WE CAN'T RENT THAT POOL TO ANYBODY. BECAUSE IT'S AN OPERATION CONTINUOUSLY. WE HAVE HAD A FEW HEATED DISCUSSIONS WITH MEMBERS OF THE COUNCIL HERE ABOUT WHY WE CAN'T REPRESENT THE POOL. WE CAN'T CLOSE IT BECAUSE IT'S THE ONLY ONE THAT WE HAVE. BECAUSE GENERATING REVENUE IS ONE POOL IS DIFFICULT WHEN YOU TRY TO HAVE IT FOR PUBLIC USE. >> SO WHEN WE GO TO OUR NEIGHBORHOOD AQUATIC CENTERS, WILL WE HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM WITH THOSE OR, I MEAN -- >> NO, SIR, I AM GLAD THAT YOU ARE GIVING ME THIS OPPORTUNITY. >> I AM TRYING TO SERVE YOU UP HERE. >> I APPRECIATE IT. ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WOULD HAPPEN IS THAT YOU -- JUST LIKE ANYTHING, YOU HAVE MORE HOURS OF USE WHEN YOU HAVE MORE FACILITIES. SO IT'S JUST LIKE OUR BASEBALL FIELDS, OUR PICNIC SHELTERS, THE MORE YOU HAVE, THE MORE THAT YOU HAVE THE ABILITY TO RENT THEM BECAUSE YOU CAN SHIFT PEOPLE AROUND TO USE FACILITIES. SO ONE OF THE THINGS WE DON'T EVEN HAVE NOW IN OUR PARKS AND RECREATION REPERTOIRE OF SPORTS IS SWIM TEAMS. THAT'S A WHOLE GENRE WE ARE NOT EVEN IN. IN A COMMUNITY LIKE THIS IF WE HAVE THE ABILITY TO DO BASEBALL FIELDS AND SOCCER FIELDS TO FACILITATE THE PROGRAM, THEN WE COULD OFFER THAT JUST LIKE THE SCHOOL SYSTEM STRUGGLES NOW. BUT IF WE COULD GET INTO THE SWIM BUSINESS, WE CAN GENERATE REVENUE. >> IS THE SCHOOL SYSTEM GOING TO GET IN WITH US IF THEY WANT SWIMMING POOLS. >>> 0, -- OH, YES, SIR, WE HAVE HAD CONVERSATIONS. >> WE HAVE HAD CONVERSATIONS, BUT DO WE HAVE A CONTRACT? >> I THINK THAT -- I THINK THAT THAT -- >> I WILL COMMIT TO SWIM TEAMS BUT DON'T MAKE ME SIGN. >> WELL, I THINK THAT IF YOU HAD IT AND YOU COULD HAVE A BETTER CONVERSATION, MY MR. WEST'S APPEARANCE HERE IS TALKING ABOUT THE FACILITIES GIVES US THE INDICATION THAT IT IS SOMETHING THEY WOULD BE AMENABLE TO. >> NO OFFENSE, AMENABLE AND COMMITTED ARE TWO WORDS. I HAVE BEEN AMENABLE TO A LOT OF LADIES IN MY YOUNG LIFE, BUT I COMMITTED TO ONE. >> YOU HAD TO OPEN THAT CAN. >> WE WOULD WAIT UNTIL THE INK WAS DRY. >> YOU HAVE TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT WORDS. >> LET ME SAY THIS. WHEN WE LOOK AT THE REPORT, AND I AM GLAD TO SEE THE FOLKS FROM THE CHAMBER HERE, ONE OF THE THINGS WE TALK UTIS THE IMAGE OF THE CITY -- ABOUT IS THE IMAGE OF THE CITY AND HOW WE CAN IMPROVE THE IMAGE OF THE CITY. AND WHAT -- IF YOU HAD TO PICK FIVE PROJECTS, AND ONLY FIVE, WHICH FIVE WOULD HAVE THE BIGGEST IMPACT ON THE CITY? >> I THINK THE FIRST -- THE BIG FIVE WE PUT UP, IF THAT WAS A QUESTION, THE ONLY REASON THAT I WOULD HESITATE IS BECAUSE WE HAVE THE ABILITY FOR FAMILIES TO GO OUT TO OUR NEIGHBORHOOD PARKS AND JUST BE A FAMILY IS SOMETHING I WOULD HESITATE ON BUT IF YOU ARE LOOKING FOR SOMETHING LIKE ECONOMIC IMPACT, THEN THE FIVE MAJOR PROJECTS GIVES US THAT ECONOMIC IMPACT, AND CHANGES FAYETTEVILLE TO BECOMING A DESTINATION, A REASON FOR PEOPLE TO COME HERE, DO SOMETHING, FROM A LEISURE SERVICES STANDPOINT. IT GETS US INTO THE GAME. >> OKAY. AND I'M GOING TO FOLLOW UP. IF YOU DIDN'T GET THOSE FIVE, ARE OUR CURRENT PARKS HAVE AN ECONOMIC IMPACT? AND IF NOT, WHAT CAN WE DO WITH OUR CURRENT PARKS TO CHANGE THAT IMAGE? >> WELL, IT'S COMPETITION. I MEAN, WE'RE IN A -- WE'RE IN A, GIVE YOU A PRIME EXAMPLE. WE ARE TALKING NOW WITH THE CONVENTIONS BUREAU. ABOUT RETOOLING THE SPORTS AUTHORITY. TO BRING IN SPORTS TOURNAMENTS. THE ISSUES IS ALWAYS VENUES. BECAUSE WHEN YOU GO UP THERE, RIGHT NOW, I THINK LAST YEAR, WE'RE HOSTING 400 SOCCER TEAMS. IN THIS COMMUNITY. WE'VE DONE IT FOR THE PAST THREE YEARS, BUT EVERY YEAR, MR. ARP, THE GREENSBOROS AND THE RALEIGHS, AND THE CHARLOTTES COME AFTER THOSE 400 TEAMS. RIGHT NOW THEY STAY WITH US BECAUSE WE TREAT THEM WELL. WE GIVE THEM CONVENIENCE, IT'S EASY TO NAVIGATE, CUMBERLAND COUNTY A LOT EASIER SO UNLESS WE DECIDE TO CHANGE THE WAY WE DO BUSINESS AND COMPETE WITH BETTER VENUES, THEY ARE NOT GOING TO STAY MUCH LONGER BECAUSE THOSE COMMUNITIES WILL DO A BETTER JOB OF CONVINCING THEM TO LEAVE. >> I JUST -- I'LL CLOSE WITH THIS. IN PRINCIPLE, I'M IN FAVOR OF WHAT WE ARE TRYING TO DO HERE. I LIKE THE IDEA OF THE PARKS REFERENDUM, YOU KNOW, I LIKE THE IDEA OF ALLOWING THE CITIZENS TO DO THE JOB ON THE SITUATION BUT I AM CONCERNED ABOUT THE TIMING. I AM CONCERNED BECAUSE UNFORTUNATELY A LOT OF THE FEEDBACK I AM RECEIVING IS NOT TO THE AFFIRMATIVE. IT'S TO THE NEGATIVE. SO YOU HAVE HEARD SEVERAL OTHER COUNCILMEMBERS TALK TONIGHT ABOUT ABOUT TABLING THIS, TAKING 30 DAYS, LOOKING AT IT A LITTLE BIT MORE DETAIL. I'M CONCERNED THAT WE'VE GONE FROM 65 MILLION AS A CITY-COUNTY PROJECT TO NOW WE ARE GOING TO $55 MILLION AND THE CITY IS BEARING THAT BURDEN. AND YOU KNOW, AND I KNOW SOME OF OUR FELLOW CITIZENS THAT ARE SERVING IN OTHER GOVERNMENTAL BOARDS ARE IN FAVOR OF DOING THIS, BUT MY CONCERN IS THEY'RE NOT THE ONES FUNDING IT. THEY ARE NOT THE ONES THAT, YOU KNOW, FIVE, TEN YEARS FROM NOW WILL BE TRYING TO FIND THE OPERATIONAL COST FUNDS TO FUND IT. AND FRANKLY, YOU KNOW, I THINK YOU DO A GREAT JOB BUT AS I RIDE AROUND AND LOOK AT OUR CURRENT PARKS, WE NEED TO BE FUNDING OUR CURRENT PARKS MORE TODAY THAN WE ARE. AND SO, YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING WE AS A BODY HAVE TO ACCEPT RESPONSIBILITY FOR. BECAUSE IN DISCUSSIONS WITH YOU AND MR. KRISTOFF ON FRIDAY YOU SAID YOUR BUDGET'S BEEN CUT. I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT WE MAINTAIN OUR PARKS BUT AT THE SAME TIME -- SO, I GUESS MY QUESTION IS, YOU KNOW, TO YOU IN CLOSING, THAT WE JUST, I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THE CITIZENS, WHEN THEY ASK MICHAEL, WE CAN ANSWER THEM, CAN WE DO THIS, CAN WE MAINTAIN THESE? CAN WE KEEP THEM OPERATING 10 YEARS FROM NOW SO WHEN THEY GO DOWN AND YOU -- LIKE THE PARK I WENT TO TONIGHT AND TALKED TO RESIDENTS, THAT IT DOESN'T LOOK THE WAY IT DOES TODAY. >> YOU WANT TO SPEAK TO THAT? I THINK IT WAS A QUESTION. IN OUR CAPITAL PROJECTS, I THINK ONE OF THE THINGS THAT, ESPECIALLY THE MAJOR FIVE PROJECTS THAT WE ALREADY HAVE, WITH OUR SENIOR CENTER INSIDE THE MULTIPURPOSE AQUATIC CENTER, WITH THE TRACK AND FIELD FACILITY AND AQUATICS FACILITY, WE ALREADY HAVE BUDGETS FOR THAT. ONE OF THE THINGS WE WOULD DO FOR OUR SENIOR CENTER, THE ONE THAT WE HAVE ON BLUE STREET NOW, WE WOULD CLOSE THAT. AND MOVE THAT, THAT PERSONNEL, THAT CITY PERSONNEL INTO THIS NEW FACILITY. WE ALREADY HAVE ATHLETIC COORDINATORS THAT WE HAVE IN OUR, IN OUR 121 LAYMAN STREET BUILDING, WE WOULD MOVE INTO THESE FACILITIES. OUR TENNIS CENTER THAT WE RUN DOWN, WE ALREADY PAY SOMEBODY TO RUN THAT FOR US AND MANAGE IT. WE WOULD JUST BE MOVING STAFF BECAUSE WE WOULD HAVE BETTER FACILITIES. AS FAR AS WHAT DO WE DO 10 YEARS FROM NOW, I THINK THAT AS THIS COMMUNITY GROWS, AND THESE FACILITIES GENERATE REVENUE, THEY BECOME SELF-SUFFICIENT. NOW, IS, IS 95% SELF-EFFICIENT? THEN THAT'S THE QUESTION THAT YOU WOULD HAVE TO ASK YOURSELF. BUT AS FAR AS THE REVENUE GENERATION ON THESE FACILITIES, I'VE BEEN AROUND THE STATE, I HAVE SEEN SOME OF THE ACTIVITIES GOING ON. THERE ARE TREMENDOUS SPORTS VENUES THAT MAKE TREMENDOUS AMOUNTS OF MONEY. HOW WE MANAGE THESE FACILITIES, HOW WE TAKE CARE OF THEM, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE HAVE IN THIS COMMUNITY NOW BASED ON OUR CURRENT PARKS AND RECREATION INVENTORY IS THAT WE HAVE A USER PROBLEM. WE HAVE MORE PEOPLE USING OUR FACILITIES EVERY DAY, AND I ALWAYS USE THE INFERENCE, WE HAVE THREE SEMIPRO FOOTBALL TEAMS AND TWO OF WOMEN TEAMS THAT GO OUT AND USE OUR FACILITIES EVERY DAY AND WE CAN'T SPREAD THEM OUT BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH FACILITIES BASED ON OUR MASTER PLAN NUMBERS WHERE -- HOW DEFICIENT WE WERE IN 2006 FOR THE POPULATION WE HAD THEN. NOW IT'S 2012 AND OUR POPULATION HAS GROWN. SO IF YOU KEEP THE SAME ASSETS FOR THE NEXT FIVE TO TEN YEARS, THEN YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE A WEAR ISSUE AND A USAGE ISSUE THAT YOU'RE NEVER GOING TO BE ABLE TO ACCOMMODATE BECAUSE OF THE POPULATION. THE URBANIZATION OF THIS COMMUNITY. THANK YOU, SIR. >> MS. APPLEWHITE? >> I PROMISE I'LL BE VERY QUICK. I THINK WE'RE JUST ABOUT READY FOR A VOTE HERE. TWO QUESTIONS. MR. GIBSON, CAN YOU PUT BACK THE SLIDE THAT HAD THE RADIUS, THE DISTANCE? THAT CIRCLE RIGHT THERE. YEAH, THAT'S FINE. SO THE, THE FAMILY AQUATIC CENTERS THAT ARE IN THE NEIGHBORHOODS, THE ONES THAT ARE IN THE NEIGHBORHOODS. >> YES, MA'AM. >> THEY'RE OUTDOOR POOLS? >> YES, MA'AM. >> AND THAT OUTDOOR SEASON IS FROM WHAT TO WHAT? >> THE MAY 30th OR WHAT'S -- AT THE -- MEMORIAL DAY TO -- NOW, AND TRADITIONALLY WE HAVE NOTS EXTENDED THAT TIME TO THE END OF THE SUMMER TO THE FIRST OF SEPTEMBER BUT IT'S ROUGHLY 28 WEEKS. >> OKAY. NOW I'M SORRY COULD YOU GO TO THE OTHER SLIDES WITH THE CIRCLES ON THERE? OKAY. SO IF YOU LOOK -- IF YOU USE THAT LINE RIGHT DOWN THE MIDDLE, THE ALL AMERICAN, IF YOU LOOK TO THE LEFT WE HAVE NEIGHBORHOOD CENTERS WITH AQUATIC CENTERS ALL OUTDOORS THAT WILL BE USED 28 WEEKS OUT OF THE YEAR AND I WILL ASSUME THE TENNIS CENTER IS INDOOR ALL YEAR ROUND? >> THE TENNIS CENTER IS OUTDOORS. >> THAT TENNIS CENTER IS OUTDOOR AS WELL. SO YOU HAVE ALL OUTDOOR AS WELL. I GUESS PEOPLE PLAY TENNIS ALL YEAR ROUND IN THIS CLIMATE. NOW WHEN YOU GO ON THE OTHER SIDE OF ALL AMERICAN, I AM GOING TO PLAY A LITTLE DISTRICT POLITICS FOR YOU, I'M 28314 I AM ALL THE WAY TO THE LEFT. NOW IF WE GO ALL THE WAY OVER AND LOOK AT THE MULTIPURPOSE AQUATIC AND SENIOR CENTER, IS THAT AN INDOOR FACILITY? >> YES, MA'AM. >> IS THAT OPERATIONAL 24 -- ALL YEAR ROUND? >> YES, MA'AM. >> OKAY. THAT SPORTS COMPLEX, IS THAT AN INDOOR FACILITY? >> NO, MA'AM. IT'D BE OUTDOOR. >> IT'S ALL OUTDOOR? SO THERE IS ONE POOL, A SKATEBOARD PARK IS OUTDOORS, OKAY, SO THERE'S STILL ONE POOL THAT WILL BE ACCESSIBLE TO OUR COMMUNITY 365? >> YES, MA'AM. >> AND THAT IS IF WE WERE TO PUT THAT, SO IF YOU LOOK AT MY KIDS RIGHT HERE, 28314, HOW FAR IS IT TO GET TO THE INDOOR POOL? HOW MANY MILES IS THAT? >> I WOULD SAY ROUGHLY FROM -- AND IF YOU USE FISHER ROAD WHERE I LIVE AT, OUT THAT WAY, I WOULD SAY PROBABLY ABOUT SEVEN TO EIGHT MILES. >> SEVEN TO EIGHT MILES. AND I'M GOING TO SAY THAT NOT JUST MY DISTRICT BUT AREAS IN COUNCILMEMBER CRISP'S AND SOME OF FOWLER'S, THERE'S NOT EVEN A BUS THAT COULD GET A KID OUT THERE. THERE'S NO TRANSPORTATION SERVICE. SO WHEN WE TALK ABOUT PROVIDING FACILITIES FOR OUR YOUTH YEAR ROUND, WESTERN FAYETTEVILLE IS STILL LIMITED TO THAT 28 WEEKS YOU TALKED ABOUT BECAUSE IT'S NOT WALKABLE, IT'S NOT BUS ACCESSIBLE, SO PARENTS, WE ARE NOT EVEN GOING TO GO THERE. SO MY QUESTION IS WE ARE IN THIS PROCESS FOR THIS BUSINESS COMMUNITY WHO WISH TO BE A PART OF THIS, WILL THERE BE A POINT WHERE WHEN CONTRACTS, RFPs ARE MADE THAT WE WILL -- I HATE THE USE THE WORD SET ASIDE. IS SET ASIDE THE RIGHT TERM? SET ASIDE FOR MINORITY LOCAL BUSINESSES? WHERE DOES THAT HAPPEN, ASSUMING THIS PASSES TONIGHT, HOW CAN WE TIE A PERCENTAGE OF WORK THAT WILL GO TO MINORITIES OR LOCAL BUSINESS PEOPLE HERE, CAN WE TIE THAT TO THIS PACKAGE SOMEHOW? >> I DON'T THINK THAT'S LEGAL, BUT LET ME EXPLAIN WHY WHAT I AM CONTEMPLATING AND TALKING WITH KRISTOFF ABOUT. I WILL BE QUICK AND I WILL BE AS CLEAN AS I THINK ABOUT THIS. ONE OF THE WAY CAPITAL PROJECTS ARE DONE, TRADITIONALLY DONE, IS THAT YOU HIRE AN ARCHITECT, THEY GIVE YOU WHAT A FACILITY LOOKS LIKE, THEN YOU TAKE THET AND PUT IT OUT ON THE SIDE OF THE STREET AND SEE IF SOMEONE CAN BUILD THIS PICTURE. ONE OF THE THINGS I WOULD LIKE TO DO AND I HAVE ADVOCATED SINCE WE STARTED THIS A YEAR AGO IS DEVELOP, DESIGN BUILD TEAMS. WE WOULD GO OUT AND ASK GROUPS OF PEOPLE TO COME IN, PROFESSIONALS THAT WOULD BE ARCHITECTS, ENGINEERS, AND CONSTRUCTION PEOPLE TO BE ON TEAMS. SO THAT WE COULD -- SO THAT WHEN THEY CAME IN, WE WOULD KNOW WHEN WE WALKED OUT OF THE ROOM WHAT THAT FINISHED PRODUCT WOULD LOOK LIKE AND THE FACT THAT WE COULD ACTUALLY BUILD IT FOR THE MONEY WE HAD. IT SAVES A LOT OF TIME. IT'S TREMENDOUSLY EFFICIENT, AND IT'S SOMETHING THAT THE PARKS AND RECREATION BUSINESS IS DOING ACROSS THE COUNTRY NOW. THAT GIVES OUR LOCAL BUSINESS PEOPLE THE OPPORTUNITY TO TEAM UP TOGETHER AND COME IN WITH A BEST POSSIBLE PLAN AND BUILDING THE STRENGTHS FROM SMALL BUSINESSES, FROM SMALL CONSTRUCTION ATTEMPTS TO GET TOGETHER TO SAY, LISTEN, LET'S GO AFTER -- THIS PROJECT. >> SO AS WE MOVE FORWARD ON THIS, SOMETIMES THESE PROJECTS KIND OF GET AWAY FROM US, AND I WOULD SAY MOST OF US GET PHONE CALLS FROM BUSINESS OWNERS WANTED TO DO BUSINESS. WE GET A LOT OF PHONE CALLS. BEFORE THIS PROJECT GETS AWAY FROM US, WILL THIS COME BACK TO COUNCIL SO WE CAN HAVE INPUT ON HOW OUR LOCAL BUSINESSES ARE INCLUDED OR NOT OR IS THIS OUT THE GATE? >> WE WILL OF COURSE HAVE TO ACQUIRE APPROPRIATE STEPS -- YOU WILL BE INVOLVED IN THIS PROCESS. >> HOW DO WE DO THIS -- WHAT HE SAID, THE DESIGN TEAMS? HOW DO WE LOCK THOSE IN? >> PROPOSALS WILL BE GRADED. RECOMMENDATION WILL COME BACK TO THE COUNCIL FOR ADOPTION. OF COURSE WE DON'T GET THERE. WE DON'T HAVE THE MONEY TO SPEND IF WE DON'T GET SOMEWHERE. THANK YOU. >> GOING DOWN THE LIST HERE. PRETTY LENGTHY. MS. DAVY. >> ALL RIGHT, THANK YOU AGAIN, FOR THE PARKS AND REC ADVISORY BOARD COMMISSION. C1 LONG WAYS AWAY, BUT IT IS NOT. SO WHAT WE WOULD DO IF COUNCIL APPROVES THIS IS WE WOULD TIE U THOSE COMMUNICATION DOCUMENTS THAT HAVE BEEN SORT OF SITTING OUT THERE WAITING FOR US TO FINALIZE, WE WOULD START TO MAK THOSE MEETINGS AND APPOINTMENTS WITH THE COMMUNITY MEETINGS. WE HAVE A PART-TIME PERSON WHO IS WORKING ON SETTING UP THAT CALENDAR FOR US. AS SOON AS WE HAVE YOUR SANCTION WE WILL START HAVING THAT CONVERSATION WITH THE COMMUNITY ABOUT WHAT IS BEING PROPOSED, WHY IT IS BEING PROPOSED, WHAT IT COSTS, HOW WE WOULD OPERATE IT. ALL THE EXCELLENT QUESTIONS YOU HAVE ASKED WE EXPECT THEM TO AS AS WELL TO MAKE AN INFORMED DECISION IN FEBRUARY. ALL WE CAN DO IS INFORM. THERE MAY BE OTHERS IN THE COMMUNITY WHO ARE WILLING TO STEP UP AS FAR AS PRIVATE SUPPORT. >> ONE FINAL COMMENT. TO CLARIFY, ONE OF THE REASONS I'M ASKING FOR MORE TIME TO SETTLE THIS IS THE QUESTION HAS BEEN ASKED TO ME, WHY WOULD YOU SPEND $582,000 TO BUILD A SKATEBOARD PARK WHICH IS A BRIDGE AND A HALF TOO FAR FROM THE KIDS IN MY DISTRICT. IT'S MY IMPRESSION AND CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG MR. GIBSON, I BELIEVE THE MAJORITY OF SKATEBOARDERS ARE 16 AND UNDER. SO HOW WILL THEY GET FROM WAY OUT THERE TO THE SKATEBOARD PARK? ONE OF THE THINGS I WOULD LIKE TO TALK ABOUT IF WE DO HAVE ADDITIONAL TIME, WHY DON'T WE TAKE THAT $582,000, BREAK IT DOWN AND PUT A SMALL SKATEBOARD TYPE FACILITY WHERE YOU ARE PUTTING EACH OF THESE OUTDOOR POOLS. >> MR. BAUER, LET ME ASK A COUPLE OF ADMINISTRATIVE THINGS WOULD YOU GO BACK AND SHARE WITH US THE COMMITMENT WE MADE TONIGHT TO FUNDING ADDITIONAL POLICE STAFFING AND WHAT THAT WOULD REPRESENT OVER AN EQUAL PERIOD OF TIME HERE. >> YES. OVER THE FIVE-YEAR PERIOD THAT TOTAL COST ADDING 28 PERSONNEL IS $2.8 MILLION, IF YOU STRETCH THROUGH THE LIFE OF THE BONDS THAT TOTAL INVESTMENT WOULD BE $54 MILLION. >> $54 MILLION DECISION WAS MAD BY THIS COUNCIL TONIGHT AS IT RELATES TO PUBLIC SAFETY. IS THAT A FAIR STATEMENT? >> FAIR STATEMENT. >> I WANT TO TOUCH ON SOMETHING, PEOPLE WHO HAVE DONE SUCCESSFUL BOND PACKAGES, IT IS AN UPHILL BATTLE TO GET ONE PASSED. IT IS UP TO THE CITIZENS TO MAKE THAT DECISION. IS THAT ONEÑ/5 OF THE REASONS I HAS SO MANY HOOKS AND SPREAD ACROSS THE COMMUNITY GEOGRAPHICALLY AND IN USE, SKATERS, SWIMMERS, BASEBALL PLAYERS, MULTIUSE FACILITIES. IS THAT PART OF THE STRATEGY? >> WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE MASTER PLAN THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT THEY SAID. WE NEED A MYRIAD OF FACILITIES TO KEEP UP WITH DIVERSE COMMUNITY. >> IN ORDER TO PASS ONE IT HAS TO HAVE SOMETHING FOR EVERYBODY >> I AGREE, MAYOR. FRAGMENTING THE COMMUNITY IS NO SOMETHING PARKS AND RECREATION IS INTERESTED IN. WE GET CALLS FROM BASEBALL PLAYERS, TENNIS PLAYERS, RUNNERS, SWIMMERS, WE WANTED TO MAKE SURE WE BROUGHT SOMETHING TO THE COMMUNITY THAT HAD INTEREST FOR THE TOTAL COMMUNITY. >> WHEN WE STARTED THIS JOURNEY SIX YEARS AGO, I REMEMBER THE MASTER PLAN QUOTE-UNQUOTE, COMING BACK. THE TOTAL PRICE OF THAT WAS $80 MILLION SOMETHING? >> $82 MILLION. >> NOW AFTER WE REFNED IT AND THE COUNTY MADE DECISIONS AND I WOULD BE CITY PROJECTS. WHAT WOULD WE HAVE A BOND PACKAGE FOR? WHAT WOULD WE BE BORROWING? I THINK THAT NUMBER IS DIFFERENT. >> DEBT INCURRED IS $46 MILLION. >> $46 MILLION. SO WE STARTED AT $82 MILLION SIX YEARS AGO COMMUNITY BASED AND W WOULD BE BORROWING $46 MILLION FOR THE BOND TO BE SUCCESSFUL? >> YES, SIR. >> OKAY. >> I THINK THAT'S EVERYBODY'S LIGHTS ON THE QUESTIONS. WE'LL GO BACK TO MISS DAVY, I THINK IF MY SHEETS ARE CORRECT. FOR A MOTION. MS. DAVY? >> I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO DIRECT STAFF TO PLACE A GENERAL OBLIGATION BOND REFERENDUM TO FINANCE VARIOUS PARKS AND RECREATION IMPROVEMENTS FOR THE CITY ON THE BALLOT IN FEBRUARY 2013. >> SECOND. >> HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND. I'M SURE THERE WILL BE SOME DISCUSSION ON THIS. WE'LL START A NEW SET OF LIGHTS. >> I JUST WANT TO CLARIFY, THE $86 MILLION THAT WAS PREVIOUSLY PLANNED, THAT WAS THE TOTAL PRICE, NOT AFTER THE REVENUE GENERATED THAT WOULD BRING IT DOWN TO THE $54 MILLION. >> ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT, I'M SORRY, THE $82 MILLION? >> THE BOND REFERENDUM IS $54 MILLION, IT GOES DOWN TO $46 MILLION. >> THE $46 MILLION IS WHAT WE USED DEBT FOR. THE REST IS PAID FOR CASH AND EXISTING RESOURCES. >> $86 MILLION IS THE TOP FIGURE -- >> THAT IS A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT SET OF PROJECTS. >> I THINK WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT IS YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT THE MASTER PLAN BOOK. IF WE DID EVERYTHING IN THAT BOOK IN 2006, THAT PRICE TAG THEN WAS $82 MILLION. >> THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN THE TOTAL AMOUNT BORROWED? >> DON'T KNOW. WE NEVER GOT TO THAT POINT IN THE PROCESS. >> I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE IT IS AN APPLES TO APPLES COMPARISON. I'M CERTAINLY IN FAVOR OF THIS GOING TO THE CITIZENS FOR A VOTE, BUT I'M NOT IN FAVOR OF I GOING TONIGHT. I HAVE A LOT OF QUESTIONS I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE ANSWERED. IN PRINCIPLE, I SUPPORT IT, BUT I STILL HAVE SOME THINGS I WOULD LIKE TO GET ANSWERED. I WOULD LIKE TO WORK ON THIS FOR ABOUT 30 DAYS. >> MR. HEAR? >> YES, THANK YOU. WE HAVE BEEN WORKING PRETTY GOOD WITH THIS TONIGHT AND BEING VER RESPECTFUL TO EACH OTHER. IN 28306 ZIP CODE WITH WHAT WE ARE REQUESTING ON THE BOND BECAUSE THERE WAS A LEGITIMATE QUESTION THAT CAME UP THAT CAME UP ABOUT A SUBSTATION OR SOMETHING ALONG THAT LINE. CAN SOMETHING LIKE THAT BE PUT IN THAT ZIP CODE? >> THE ONLY THING LISTED FOR 28306 IS A NEIGHBORHOOD PARK AN A NEIGHBORHOOD POOL. >> IT WAS SOMETHING IN THAT AREA, A BUILDING -- >> I THINK -- NO, SIR. >> NO? NOTHING IN THAT -- IN THE WESTERN AREA WHERE THERE WAS SOMETHING ENCLOSED? >> NO, SIR. THERE IS NOT. >> OKAY. THEN I MISUNDERSTOOD. THANK YOU, SIR. >> MR. FOWLER. >> THIS IS JUST A COMMENT OR QUESTION FOR THE COUNCIL. DO YOU THINK THIS BOND WOULD HAVE A BETTER CHANCE OFR■ APPRO IF YOU HAD STRONG CONSENSUS ON THE COUNCIL SENDING IT FORWARD OR WEAK CONSENSUS OR NO CONSENSUS AND YOU MIGHT HAVE A CHANCE TO HAVE STRONG CONSENSUS 30 DAYS FROM NOW AS OPPOSED TO TONIGHT? >> MR. BATES? >> I STRONGLY SUPPORT PUTTING THIS ON REFERENDUM AND ALLOWING THE CITIZENS TO VOTE. I APPRECIATE YOUR HARD WORK. YOU ARE KNOWLEDGEABLE AND HAVE DONE GREAT. OUR BOARD MEMBERS HAVE WORKED HARD. FROM EVERYTHING I HAVE GATHERED FROM THE CITIZENS, THIS IS NOT GOING TO PASS AT $50 MILLION. $45 MILLION. THAT IS NOT GOING TO PASS. I FAVOR 30 DAYS TO TAKE A LOOK TO SEE IF THERE IS SOMETHING WE CAN DO TO MAKE SURE IT DOES PASS. EVERYTHING I HEAR THEY ARE TELLING ME, NOBODY IS VOTING FO IT. THEY ARE NOT GOING TO VOTE FOR IT. SO THAT IS JUST MY -- >> OKAY, THANK YOU, SIR. I DO THINK THIS IS A COMPLICATE ISSUE AND COUNCIL MEMBERS HAVE BEEN RESPECTFUL ON. I CERTAINLY APPRECIATE THAT. I DON'T THINK IT IS BEING TAKEN IN ISOLATION. THAT IS WHY I ASKED THE QUESTION ABOUT THE INVESTMENT IN THE POLICE DEPARTMENT. WE IMPROVE OUR COMMUNITY IN A LOT OF WAYS AT EVERY COUNCIL. WE HAVE DONE THAT TONIGHT WITH THE APPROVAL OF THE BUDGET. THIS IS NOT IN ISOLATION AND DOESN'T MEAN IT IS NOT IMPORTANT AND DOESN'T MEAN WE ARE NOT MOVING FORWARD IN THOSE AREAS. THIS WEEKEND 208,000 PEOPLE IN THE CITY DID NOT HAVE A SWIMMING POOL. SO I WOULD ASK YOU, WHERE WERE THOSE CHILDRENwç: AT THIS WEEKE THERE WASN'T A TENNIS COURT FOR THEM TO PLAY ON. WASN'T A SWIMMING POOL FOR THEM TO GO TO. WASN'T A SKATEBOARD PARK FOR MOST OF THEM TO GET TO. WHAT WERE THEY DOING? AND I WOULD ASK YOU THIS BEFORE WE VOTE, DO YOU REALLY THINK THAT 30 DAYS IS GOING TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE? >> YES, SIR. >> WELL, I JUST ASK YOU TO THIN ABOUT IT BEFORE YOU ANSWER THAT. I JUST MADE A LIST OF ALL WE HAVE TALKED ABOUT TONIGHT AS WE THROW EVERYTHING -- I'M SPEAKING RIGHT NOW, SIR. >> I HEAR YOU. >> AS WE THROW EVERYTHING ON TH WALL, QUESTIONING INDOOR/OUTDOOR, WHETHER I HAVE ENOUGH IN MY DISTRICT OR EAST FAYETTEVILLE OR WEST FAYETTEVILLE, WHETHER WE WANT T INCLUDE A POLICE SUBSTATION, SE ASIDE FOR THE CONTRACTORS THAT BUILD IT OR DESIGN IT, REDUCE THE SCOPE BECAUSE IT ISN'T GOING TO SELL. DO YOU THINK IT IS GOING TO BE ANY EASIER A MONTH FROM NOW? THOSE ARE LEGITIMATE POINTS. THEY ARE GOOD AND I'M NOT CRITICAL OF ANY OF THEM. IT IS A VERY, VERY COMPLICATED SCENARIO. ALL WE ARE ASKING TONIGHT IS TO GIVE US TIME TO BE SUCCESSFUL AND LET THE CITIZENS OF THIS COMMUNITY VOTE. WE ARE NOT ARGUING FOR IT PRO O CON. WE ARE JUST ASKING CAN WE ALLOW THE CITIZENS TO VOTE AND GIVE US THE TIME TO PLAN?c LET ME MAKE SURE I DIDN'T MISS ANYBODY. MR. BATES, DID YOU HAVE YOUR QUESTION ANSWERED? MS. APPLEWHITE. >> I WOULD. I WILL SAY THAT, AGAIN, MIKE, W PUT A LOT INTO THIS AND WE HAVE A PASSION FOR CHILDREN. I FIND IT DISINGENUOUS WE ARE S CONCERNED FOR THE CHILDREN IN YOUR COMMUNITY WE NEED A $46 MILLION BOND PACKAGE TO CREATE ALL THE ILLS WE HAVE WITH OUR YOUTH.çSx WE HAVE TRIED NUMEROUS THINGS ON THIS COUNCIL. WE ARE HERE TRYING TO PASS A BOND, NOW WE ARE TALKING CHILDREN. WHEN WE HAD THAT VIDEO GO VIRAL THAT TALKED ABOUT THE GANGS IN OUR COMMUNITY THAT THREATENED THE DOGWOOD FESTIVAL, THAT WAS NOTHING NEW. NO ONE WAS SURPRISED ABOUT THAT. THAT HAS BEEN EXISTING IN OUR NEIGHBORHOODS FOR YEARS AND WE'VE NEVER DONE ANYTHING ABOUT IT. BUT NOW IT IS TIME TO PASS A BOND, NOW IT'S LET'S SAVE THE CHILDREN. THE SECOND THING I WOULD SAY IS THAT, YES, I ALSO AGREE THAT TH CITIZENS SHOULD HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO VOTE. BUT IF WE ARE GOING TO PUT $100,000 ON A REFERENDUM WHEN B ALL ACCOUNTS OUR CITIZENS ARE SAYING YOU ARE WASTING YOUR TIM AND YOUR MONEY, YOU BETTER BRING US SOMETHING THAT IS MANAGEABLE I THINK THAT IS WHAT WE ARE HEARING HERE. IF THERE IS A POSSIBILITY WE WANT TO THROW GOOD MONEY OUT OF THE WINDOW, PUT THIS PACKAGE ON THE REFERENDUM. IF WE SCALE IT BACK, TWEAK IT, ADDRESS CONCERNS. I DON'T THINK IT IS FRIVOLOUS TO ASK QUESTIONS ABOUT BUSINESSES. I HAVE GOTTEN CALLS FROM SMALL BUSINESSES. ONE BUSINESS OWNER SAID IF YOU DON'T ADDRESS IT WE WILL GO ON OUR CAMPAIGN TO DEFEAT THIS REFERENDUM. SO PERHAPS, MAYOR, IT IS NOT 30 DAYS. MAYBE IT NEEDS TO BE 60 OR 90. WE CAN'T BE IN A RUSH TO SPEND $46 MILLION. >> THANK YOU, MA'AM. >> MR. HARE? >> WHAT I WANTED TO UNDERSTAND IS IF THIS ITEM WAS TO -- WHICHEVER WAY THIS ITEM GOES TONIGHT, LET'S JUST SAY IT WAS TO PASS. IF IT WAS TO PASS, FROM THIS POINT HERE TO FEBRUARY MR. CITY MANAGER, WOULD WE HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE DIALOGUE LIKE WE ARE HAVING TONIGHT, TWEAKING THAT MAY NEED TO BE DONE, CHANGES THAT COULD POSSIBLY TAKE PLACE. WE MOST DEFINITELY ARE GOING TO HAVE TO HAVE PUBLIC HEARINGS, I ASSUME. ANOTHER CONCERN I ASKED YOU IN THE LAFAYETTE ROOM AND YOU SAID IT HAD TO COME BEFORE US FIRST, UP OR DOWN FIRST. IF IT IS UP, WOULD WE GO INTO DIFFERENT SECTORS OF THE COMMUNITY AND MAKE THIS PRESENTATION? COULDN'T ALL OF THE CONCERNS WHICH ARE VERY, VERY LEGITIMATE CONCERNS TONIGHT, COULDN'T ALL OF THOSE CONCERNS BE ADDRESSED AFTERWARDS AND THEN WE COULD KIND OF LOOK AT THOSE THINGS BETWEEN NOW AND THE NEXT FEW MONTHS? IS THAT -- I MEAN, COULD THAT NOT WORK? >> I UNDERSTAND YOUR QUESTION, COUNCIL MEMBER. WE NEED TO HAVE A STABLE PACKAGE TO HAVE A CONVERSATION WITH THE COMMUNITY. >> THAT IS WHAT I'M SAYING. >> SO WE WOULD NEED -- >> YES. THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT I'M SAYING IF THE VOTE IS UP, MORE GREEN FOR THAN RED AGAINST, THEN ALL OF THE CONCERNS THAT WE'RE SPEAKING OF TONIGHT, ARE THOSE THINGS THAT COULD BE ADDRESSED AND CHANGED? >> SOME WE COULD AND SOME, TO BE BLUNT, WE COULDN'T. IF THERE IS INTEREST ON COUNCIL OF TAKING PROJECTS OUT, CHANGIN PROJECTS, THEN THAT WOULD UNDERCUT OUR ABILITY TO HAVE THAT CONVERSATION WITH THE COMMUNITY. WE COULDN'T TELL THEM WHAT WAS GOING TO BE BEFORE THEM IN FEBRUARY BECAUSE YOU ARE STILL PLAYING WITH IT. SO WE NEED TO BE ABLE TO HAVE CLARITY ABOUT WHAT IS GOING TO -- WHAT THEY ARE DECIDING ON BEFORE WE CAN HAVE THAT CONVERSATION. >> THERE ARE A NUMBER OF THINGS THAT COULD BE ADDRESSED. ALL THE THINGS THE MAYOR WAS JUST BRINGING OUT. BUT WE HEARD ABOUT THE SMALL BUSINESS ISSUES. THAT IS A BIG CONCERN OF THE COUNCIL. SHOOT, THAT IS A BIG CONCERN OF MINE. I BROUGHT IT TO THE TABLE. THESE THINGS ARE VERY, VERY IMPORTANT. COULD WE NOT HAVE THOSE DISCUSSIONS? >> A NUMBER OF THOSE DISCUSSION WE COULD HAVE AND, IN FACT, WE WILL HAVE TO HAVE SHOULD THIS B SUCCESSFUL IS THAT THESE ARE PRELIMINARY SCHEMATICS. THERE IS A LOT OF WORK TO HAVE WITH THE COUNCIL AND THE COMMUNITY TO FLUSH OUT THESE FACILITIES AS FAR AS FINAL DESIGN. THAT IS SOMETHING THAT IF THIS PASSES WE'LL BE HAVING THOSE CONVERSATIONS OVER THE NEXT FIVE YEARS. >> OKAY. I WANT TO MAKE SURE I GOT EVERYBODY. IT HAS BEEN A GOOD DISCUSSION. MR. FOWLER, GO AHEAD. >> YES MR. MAYOR. I APPRECIATE YOUR PASSION AND DESIRE FOR OUR CITY TO BE A GREAT PLACE TO LIVE. I SHARE THAT PASSION, BUT I WAN TO ANSWER A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS BECAUSE YOU FRAMED IT THAT THE CHILDREN WILL HAVE ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO IF THE PARKS ARE NOT THERE. I SUGGEST THERE IS PLENTY PARTICULARLY FOR FAMILIES TO DO AS FAMILIES. AT COMMUNITY PARK OR ANOTHER FACILITY SUCH AS WE HAD THE SITUATION WITH THE MALL SAYING IF YOU ARE UNDER 18 YOU CAN'T COME NLGS YOU ARE WITH A PARENT UNSUPERVISED CHILDREN AT THE MALL OR SOME OTHER STORE OR AT THE PARK ARE GOING TO BE THAT. UNSUPERVISED CHILDREN THAT CAN CREATE PROBLEMS. WHAT MANY FAMILIES CAN DO IS THEY CAN DO THINGS TOGETHER. THERE ARE OTHER ISSUES. WE ACT AS IF THIS DOES NOT PASS THERE ARE NO OTHER OPTIONS. THERE'S SCOUTS. THERE ARE CHURCH YOUTH GROUPS. LET'S NOT MAKE IT THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO IF THIS ISN'T PASSED. SO I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE WE WERE CLEAR ON THAT. >> WE ARE CRYSTAL CLEAR ON THAT. I DIDN'T SAY THAT. I SAID LAST WEEKEND 208,000 PEOPLE LIVE IN THIS CITY AND THERE WASN'T A PUBLIC POOL FOR OUR CHILDREN. WE SHOULD BE EMBARRASSED BY THAT. 208,000 PEOPLE LIVE IN THIS CIT AND THE FIRST WEEKEND AFTER SCHOOL WAS OUT THERE WAS NO PUBLIC POOL FOR SOMEONE TO SWIM IN. NOW SCOUTS AND ALL THE OTHER THINGS, THEY ARE WORTHWHILE PROJECTS. NO PUBLIC POOL FOR 208,000 PEOPLE WHO LIVE HERE. OKAY. MAKE SURE WE ARE CLEAR. MS. DAVY, RESTATE THE MOTION. I'M SORRY MR. CRIST. >> YOU ASKED A QUESTION, DO I THINK 30 DAYS WILL MAKE A DIFFERENCE? MY RESPONSE IS MOST ASSUREDLY. A LADY SAID TO ME WHEN I WAS STANDING IN H CHURCH ON SUNDAY. YOU ALL ARE GOING TO DO WHAT YO DO ANYWAY TO RAM IT DOWN OUR THROATS. THIS IS WHAT I NEED TO COUNTER TO MAKE THE PRESENTATION TO THEM THAT YOU MADE TO US. IF WE HAVE ANY CHANCE OF THIS BEING APPROVED WE NEED TO BE CONCERTED AND TOGETHER IN HERE AND WE CAN'T DO THAT UNTIL I'M ASSURED THAT MY CITIZENS UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU ARE SELLING TO THEM. I LIKE IT. I'VE SAID THAT. THEY PUT ME IN THE PRESS AS HAVING SAID I LIKE IT, BUT I'M REPRESENTING A CONSTITUENCY OUT THERE THAT IS SAYING NO GO. I NEED SOME HELP IN THE NEXT 30 DAYS TO TURN THEM AROUND. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU, SIR. MR. HEARSE? >> TO CLARIFY, THAT PROCESS BEGINS AFTER TONIGHT'S VOTE. THAT IS WHEN THE EDUCATION PROCESS BEGINS NOT 30 DAYS OR 60. THEY ARE NOT CLEAR ENOUGH. WE HAVE HAD COMMUNITY MEETINGS. THEY WANT DO BE SOLD. WE BEGIN AFTER TONIGHT'S VOTE. THAT IS WHEN THE EDUCATION PROCESS OF THIS BOND ISSUE BEGINS. >> MR. HEARSE IS SPEAKING. >> BUT HE IS ATTACKING MY CREDIBILITY. >> NO, HE'S NOT. >> THE POINT I'M MAKING IS PEOPLE ARE SAYING TO ME WE ARE FIXING TO RAM IT DOWN THEIR THROAT. >> CAN MR. HEARSE SPEAK NOW? >> THANK YOU MR. MAYOR. I HAVE BEEN TO COMMUNITY MEETINGS WHERE THIS BOND PACKAG HAS BEEN PRESENTS, KIWANAS CENTER AND DOWNTOWN. TO THEIR MEETINGS WHEN THEY TALKED ABOUT THIS IN 2007 AND 2009 SAND AS RECENTLY AS LAST YEAR. I HAVE HEARD IT. I HAVE SEEN IT TWEAKED. I HAVE SEEN IT PRESENTED BY MR. PONE. I HAVE HEARD IT. I HAVE LISTENED IT. THE OBSERVER HAS BROADCAST IT. PEOPLE HAVE TALKED ABOUT IT. EDUCATION PROCESS BEGINS AFTER TONIGHT'S VOTE. >> MR. MASSEY? >> I WOULD LIKE TO CALL THE QUESTION, PLEASE. >> ALL RIGHT, SIR. >> IF IT IS OKAY WITH THE COUNCIL AND WITH MS. DAVY BECAUSE IT IS HER MOTION, I'D LIKE TO OFFER A FRIENDLY AMENDMENT FOR CONSIDERATION. I THINK THE CONCERN IS WE -- EVERYBODY HAS SOME THOUGHTS ABOUT THE PACKAGE, IS IT THE RIGHT SIZE PACKAGE, HOW ARE WE GOING TO MEASURE THIS AND GET THIS RIGHT? I THINK WHEN IT IS ALL AND SAID AND DONE AT THE END OF THE DAY, EVERYBODY WOULD LIKE TO SEE THI GO THROUGH IN SOME FORM. SO ONE OF THE QUESTIONS I ASKED A FEW MINUTES AGO IS IF WE TOOK THIS PACKAGE -- WHEN WE VOTE TONIGHT WE ARE VOTING FORá'é A BOND. THAT IS ALL WE ARE VOTING FOR. WE ARE NOT VOTING FOR WHAT THE PACKAGE IS GOING TO LOOK FOR. WE ARE VOTING FOR LETTING IT GO TO A REFERENDUM TO THE PEOPLE. THE THOUGHT I HAD WAS IF WE AGREE TONIGHT THAT WE WOULD SUPPORT A BOND REFERENDUM WITH AN AMENDMENT THAT STATES THAT PERFORMANCE MEASURES WOULD BE I PLACE IN THE BOND WHERE WE HAD GATES THAT THE CITY HAS TO MEET IN PERFORMANCE AND DELIVERING THE PRODUCT AND THE SERVICES THAT WE ARE SIGNING UP FOR TONIGHT, TO GIVE THE CITIZENS COMFORT THAT WE ARE GOING TO DO WHAT WE SAY WE ARE GOING TO DO AND DO IT TO COMPLETION MR. BAUER, NOT BUILD JUST FOR GROUP A AND NOT FOR GROUP B, WE ARE GOING TO SHOW WE ARE GOOD STEWARDS OF THE TAXPAYERS FUNDS THAT WHEN WE BUILD IT YOU HAVE TO MEET THESE GATES AND OPERATE IT OR WE DON'T EXECUTE THE BOND IN TOTALITY. THAT WOULD GIVE ASSURETY TO PEOPLE AND WE WOULD HAVE TIME TO GO BACK AND LOOK AT THE PACKAGE AFTER THIS NIGHT. >> WE'LL PROBABLY HAVE SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT THAT. MR. HARE? >> YES, SIR. I AGREE WITH YOU. I DIDN'T SAY IT EXACTLY LIKE TH LIEUTENANT COLONEL SAID, BUT I WAS JUST STATING THAT ONCE WE WENT FORWARD THERE WOULD STILL BE OPPORTUNITIES FOR US TO LOOK AT EVERY PASSION, EVERY CONCERN IF IF WE COULD DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT OR NOT ACCORDING TO THE CITY MANAGER. >> LET MR. BAUER SPEAK TO THAT. I DON'T THINK WE ARE SAYING THE SAME THING HE SAID. MAYBE WE NEED CLARIFICATION AND WE WILL GET BACK TO YOUR QUESTION MR. MASSEY. >> I'M NOT SURE I'M TRACKING WHAT THE AMENDMENT IS ASKING OF US. I'M SORRY. >> I THINK AS I LISTEN TO MY CONSTITUENTS AND FELLOW COUNCIL MEMBERS THERE IS A QUESTION ABOUT THE SIZE OF THIS BOND PACKAGE. PROBABLY THE BIGGEST THING IN MOST PEOPLE'S MIND IS IT IS A LOT OF MONEY AND ARE WE ABLE TO DELIVER THE GOODS AND SERVICES FOR SIGNING UP FOR -- AS WE GO FORWARD? SO WHAT I'M ASKING FOR, ARE THERE PERFORMANCE MEASURES THAT CAN BE IN PLACE IN THE BOND PACKAGE, IF YOU GET TO $20 MILLION AND THE FACILITIES ARE NOT GENERATING THE REVENUE, THAT WE DON'T GO -- WE DON'T KICK IN THE NEXT PHASE UNTIL WE SHOW WE ARE DOING THE THING WE PROPOSE. WE MITIGATE SOME RISK TO THE LENDER. THE LENDER IS THE CITIZEN. CAN WE DO THAT IN THE BOND PACKAGE? >> THE INITIAL PACKAGE. >> POINT OF ORDER. PARLIAMENT PROCEDURE STATES THAT WE SHOULD VOTE ON HER. >> HE ASKED FOR A FRIENDLY AMENDMENT. >> NOT AFTER A QUESTION WAS CALLED. THE QUESTION WAS CALLED BEFORE ANY REFERENCE TO A FRIENDLY AMENDMENT. WE SHOULD VOTE ON MS. DAVY'S MOTION. >> OKAY. MS. DAVY, WOULD YOU REMIND US OF THE MOTION SO WE ALL KNOW WHAT WE ARE VOTING ON. >> THE MOTION IS TO DIRECT STAFF TO PLACE A GENERAL OBLIGATION BOND REFERENDUM TO FINANCE VARIOUS PARKS AND RECREATIONS ON THE BALLOT FEBRUARY 2013. >> THAT MOTION DOES NOT CARRY. >> I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF QUESTIONS HERE. WHAT I WAS ATTEMPTING TO DO WAS TO SEE IF WE COULD MODIFY THIS. I DON'T KNOW WE CAN DO IT TONIGHT BECAUSE I THINK WE WILL BE HERE ALL NIGHT LONG. WHAT I'M SAYING IS I WOULD LIKE TO SEE SOME PERFORM MAPS MEASURES IN THE IN THE BOND PACKAGE SO CITIZENS HAVE REASSURANCE WITH THE RISK WE ARE TAKING WITH THIS KIND OF A PACKAGE. >> MR. BATES? >> I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO PUT THIS ON OUR FIRST COUNCIL MEETING IN JULY. BESIDES THE WORK COUNCIL, THE FIRST TELEVISED COUNCIL MEETING IN JULY. AND IN BETWEEN THAT TIME STAFF CAN SCHEDULE MEETINGS SPECIFICALLY FOR THIS ISSUE. DON'T TACK IT ON TO THE WORK SESSION OR TACK IT ON TO A DIFFERENT MEETING, BUT SCHEDULE A COUPLE OF SPECIFIC MEETINGS FOR THIS ISSUE. >> THAT'S GET THAT DATE REAL QUICK. >> JULY 11. >> JULY 9. >> WOULDN'T BE THE 11th, WOULD IT?nL■ >> LOOKS LIKE IT IS THE 9th. >> WHAT DAY? >> THE 9th. >> JULY THE 9th. >> TO TABLE IT UNTIL JULY 9th. >> SECOND. >> THANKS MS. APPLEWHITE. ANY ADDITIONAL DISCUSSION ON TH MOTION? LET ME ASK YOU TO VOTE, PLEASE.